Business Do top sponsors still use CCBILL for affiliate management?

[dcortez]

I have noticed that some sponsors are using CCBILL for their affiliate management.

Are there top established (+10 years in biz) sponsors that use CCBILL for affiliates, or do most switch to their own proprietary affiliate management system?

Thanks!

-Dino

[The Porn Nerd]

You will hear both answers, CCBill and NATS (their own proprietary affiliate management system). I have had my CCBill Affiliate Programs for over 10 years now while others have been with NATS that long. Some start with CCBill then switch to their own merchant account and setup.

Why are you asking? Do you want to start your own AP or are you looking for solid Sponsors to promote?

[SBJ]

I still promote mainly CCBill sites. Too many sites closing up shop and not paying out what they owe you when they do.

[dcortez]

Thanks for that.

I'm looking for solid established sponsors to promote.

-Dino

Originally Posted by The Porn Nerd

You will hear both answers, CCBill and NATS (their own proprietary affiliate management system). I have had my CCBill Affiliate Programs for over 10 years now while others have been with NATS that long. Some start with CCBill then switch to their own merchant account and setup.

Why are you asking? Do you want to start your own AP or are you looking for solid Sponsors to promote?

[AmeliaG]

SpookyCash is CCBill

I prefer promoting CCBill programs myself.

[dcortez]

Thanks Amelia.

I am familiar with your content from many (many) years ago - if you say CCBILL is OK for sponsor programs, that means a lot.

Are your CCBILL sponsors generating worthwhile revenues for you?

-Dino

Originally Posted by AmeliaG

SpookyCash is CCBill

I prefer promoting CCBill programs myself.

[The Porn Nerd]

Originally Posted by dcortez

Thanks for that.

I'm looking for solid established sponsors to promote.

-Dino

Great! Signup for my Programs below then contact me and I will show you which are the best sites to promote for your traffic.

[Look Chang]

With CCBill, affiliates are 100% sure to be paid.

[dcortez]

Thanks, I'll check that out.

-Dino

Originally Posted by The Porn Nerd

Great! Signup for my Programs below then contact me and I will show you which are the best sites to promote for your traffic.

[Boob Bucks]

We have been using CCBill for over 10 years. They handle all the payments to affiliates so it has been very helpful for us. We can focus on making content for our members and affiliates.

[BigFurry]

Originally Posted by Look Chang

With CCBill, affiliates are 100% sure to be paid.

This is very important.

For small programs I actually prefer if they're using CCBILL.

[dcortez]

That's good to know. Tens years of reliable service is a great testimonial. Thanks for that!

-Dino

Originally Posted by Boob Bucks

We have been using CCBill for over 10 years. They handle all the payments to affiliates so it has been very helpful for us. We can focus on making content for our members and affiliates.

[newB]

Originally Posted by Look Chang

With CCBill, affiliates are 100% sure to be paid.

Mostly true.

I had the misfortune a year or so ago where CCBill took it upon themselves to refund a $100 sale before also getting hit with a bank chargeback for the same sale. Rather than CCBill taking the loss, they passed both onto me, so basically I was in the hole for $100 for their decision (ie first refund erased the sale, second one put me owing them).

Spoke with several people about it and each one said "there's nothing we can do." More accurately, 'there's nothing you WILL do.'

Also, CCBill programs can easily cheat their affiliates if they want to. We've seen some selectively change payouts for affiliates, hard-linking their own CCBill ID's into affiliate pages, and linking to alternate payment processors on their join pages.

I used to be all about CCBill - I like earnings from disparate programs in one weekly payment, but these days not so much. Just my

[geirlur]

FTV Girls are pretty big and they run on ccbill

[dcortez]

They have been around for a while! Anyone from FTV on GFY?

-Dino

Originally Posted by geirlur

FTV Girls are pretty big and they run on ccbill

[bean-aid]

The problem with ccbill is their wording on join form. They purposely cause people to cancel recurring joins to limit chargebacks so the whole remains compliant. On the flip side programs outside ccbill enjoy not paying quite often so it's a revolving predicament I don't think will ever get solved.

[dcortez]

The issue of rebills/chargebacks has been contentious from day one.

I recall nefarious webmasters in 1999 deliberately setting their first rebill to 45 days to increase the chance of a members not seeing the rebill in their credit card statement, before it was too late to cancel.

This kind of underhandedness and other disingenuous tricks have made the world of payment processing as challenging for legitimate webmasters as it is.

Instead of auto rebills, why not offer one time charges for 1, 3, 6, 12 months (with discounts for longer memberships)?

-Dino

Originally Posted by beaner

The problem with ccbill is their wording on join form. They purposely cause people to cancel recurring joins to limit chargebacks so the whole remains compliant. On the flip side programs outside ccbill enjoy not paying quite often so it's a revolving predicament I don't think will ever get solved.

[SBJ]

Originally Posted by dcortez

They have been around for a while! Anyone from FTV on GFY?

-Dino

https://gfy.com/members/lagwagon/ (Chris but not sure how often he checks out GFY these days)

[RyuLion]

clubdom has been using CCBill since IBill.
https://www.clubdomcash.com/website.php

[dcortez]

Thanks for that!

-Dino

Originally Posted by SBJ

https://gfy.com/members/lagwagon/ (Chris but not sure how often he checks out GFY these days)

[dcortez]

Thanks for the info. You seem to cover your niche well, but I have a question about signing up with CCBILL...

Am I missing something, or does every sponsor collect your CCBILL account info (affiliate ID, username, and password) from their own pages (some not even secured)??

Are CCBILL affiliates expected to trust sponsors with their main CCBILL account login info?

It's one thing to create a unique login for a given sponsor, or to bounce to the trusted affiliate management site (to log in and authenticate), but to share the same global login info directly with any sponsor, does not make much security sense.

I must be misunderstanding this.

Can someone explain it please?

Thanks!

-Dino

Originally Posted by Boob Bucks

We have been using CCBill for over 10 years. They handle all the payments to affiliates so it has been very helpful for us. We can focus on making content for our members and affiliates.

[AmeliaG]

Originally Posted by dcortez

Thanks for the info. You seem to cover your niche well, but I have a question about signing up with CCBILL...

Am I missing something, or does every sponsor collect your CCBILL account info (affiliate ID, username, and password) from their own pages (some not even secured)??

Are CCBILL affiliates expected to trust sponsors with their main CCBILL account login info?

It's one thing to create a unique login for a given sponsor, or to bounce to the trusted affiliate management site (to log in and authenticate), but to share the same global login info directly with any sponsor, does not make much security sense.

I must be misunderstanding this.

Can someone explain it please?

Thanks!

-Dino

The signup form part goes to CCBill, not the program. In my experience, the program gets your name, email, and site type info, but not your password or master account number. When you sign up, you choose whether or not to share your mailing address info with the sponsor program.

[AmeliaG]

Originally Posted by dcortez

Thanks Amelia.

I am familiar with your content from many (many) years ago - if you say CCBILL is OK for sponsor programs, that means a lot.

Are your CCBILL sponsors generating worthwhile revenues for you?

-Dino

Yeah, been at it for a minute ;)

Up through 2005ish, it was pretty easy to make break for payout with kinda any remotely decent program, but I personally liked the CCBill payouts merge even then. One place to check and the dough showed up every week. Now that it is harder to make break on many programs, I prefer CCBill merged payouts even more.

For SpookyCash, the feedback I've gotten from affiliates over the years is they preferred it as well.

[rastan]

Yup, we've been with CCBill for a long time now. Not quite a decade, but a long time now anyway. Never any issues. Pay out on time, every time, for every body.
Reassuringly reliable.

[dcortez]

I looked at the code. The web page on which you enter your CCBILL password is hosted on the sponsor's site (trust level unknown) and in many cases the form submit passes to CCBILL unsecured (not https).

With active JS, burying a keylogger in the login page by a fake sponsor, is not impossible.

Or, your login info could just be sent directly to the password thief.

This is 2020, and all affiliate signup forms/processing should be done on CCBILL's servers. This is not a profoundly new concept.

When you pay for something with PayPal, you do not enter your PayPal login info on the merchant site. You are directed to the PayPal site where you log in, make your payment, and then are redirected back to the merchant. That is what buyers are expecting.

CCBILL should use a similar system.

The idea of having to check the source code of a webmaster login page, instead of relying on digital certificate security (you know when you are on a trusted processor's site - lots of visual bells and whistles), is so 90's.

Aside from the outdated security model, the idea of having affiliate revenues merged and guaranteed to be paid by CCBILL is a good thing.

-Dino

Originally Posted by AmeliaG

The signup form part goes to CCBill, not the program. In my experience, the program gets your name, email, and site type info, but not your password or master account number. When you sign up, you choose whether or not to share your mailing address info with the sponsor program.

[lagwagon]

Originally Posted by dcortez

Thanks for that!

-Dino

Yo,

Yes, we cascade CCBill and Epoch. Thanks for the plugs!

[dcortez]

Thanks for the update. You've been in the game for while!

-Dino

Originally Posted by lagwagon

Yo,

Yes, we cascade CCBill and Epoch. Thanks for the plugs!

[cordoba]

As an affiliate I avoid Ccbill sponsors these days. Most sites I promote using their Ccbill links don't even recognize my hits. Seems like a total scam. Really annoying because a lot of small niche and fetish sites use only them, and I'm on the first page of Google and don't have a Nats sponsor to send the traffic to.

[dcortez]

At this point, I'm leaning towards sponsors that use (properly configured - ie. their contact page does not show up as undefined) and established sponsors who are large enough to have their own proprietary affiliate management system.

I prefer sponsors whose affiliate stats are responsive in real time, so leak checking their FHGs and tours is possible.

It's sad to see so many larger sponsors shaving affiliate traffic by have non-affiliated alternative links on the pages affiliates are given to promote.

-Dino

Originally Posted by cordoba

As an affiliate I avoid Ccbill sponsors these days. Most sites I promote using their Ccbill links don't even recognize my hits. Seems like a total scam. Really annoying because a lot of small niche and fetish sites use only them, and I'm on the first page of Google and don't have a Nats sponsor to send the traffic to.

[Manfap]

Originally Posted by newB

Also, CCBill programs can easily cheat their affiliates if they want to. We've seen some selectively change payouts for affiliates, hard-linking their own CCBill ID's into affiliate pages, and linking to alternate payment processors on their join pages.

Any affiliate prog can cheat affiliates, it's just as easy with NATS and harder to catch.

[dcortez]

Yes, there are 99 ways to skin an affiliate.

Trust and reputation go a long way in helping affiliates sort out which sponsors are the ones to invest in, but even that is just fine until it isn't.

Transparency is helpful.

Even though stats can be manipulated, the more real time verification affiliates have to balance their expectations with sponsors' reports the better.

And then there is independent regulation and oversight.

As a mainstream software publisher, my contracts included periodic access by my accountant to the books of my publisher.

Independent third party auditing might not be a bad idea.

Every large corporation proactively audits, but as Enron hopefully taught us, even auditing requires trust and integrity.

Given the difficulties most affiliate have in getting a real peek "behind the curtain", maybe a lesser, even zero, tolerance of cheaters might be the only way to knock out bad players.

??

-Dino

Originally Posted by Manfap

Any affiliate prog can cheat affiliates, it's just as easy with NATS and harder to catch.

[newB]

Originally Posted by Manfap

Any affiliate prog can cheat affiliates, it's just as easy with NATS and harder to catch.

Absolutely. What I was trying to get across is that CCBill has this reputation for being above-board, but affiliates still need to monitor the programs they're promoting and be on the lookout for shenanigans.

That, and to rant about the double-chargeback thing again.

[rayadp05]

I've been using CCBill for my processing and for the affiliate program for 16 years now. The sales have always been very steady and they come in every day and every evening. I have always been very satisfied, along with my affiliates, as a result of implementing CCBill for our processing and for the affiliate program.

[dcortez]

That's good to know. Thanks!

-Dino

Originally Posted by rayadp05

I've been using CCBill for my processing and for the affiliate program for 16 years now. The sales have always been very steady and they come in every day and every evening. I have always been very satisfied, along with my affiliates, as a result of implementing CCBill for our processing and for the affiliate program.

[fuzebox]

Originally Posted by newB

I had the misfortune a year or so ago where CCBill took it upon themselves to refund a $100 sale before also getting hit with a bank chargeback for the same sale. Rather than CCBill taking the loss, they passed both onto me, so basically I was in the hole for $100 for their decision (ie first refund erased the sale, second one put me owing them).

Yeahhhhh welcome to high risk billing