I think education and healthcare should be free for all Americans. I would be happy to have an increased tax, or part of my salary go towards these two programs to help Americans live healthy and educated.

We use the skills we have!

Ironic that this is your message each and everytime and yet you've proven no basic understanding concerning any of the topics being discussed. At least the "morons" on both sides are attempting to debate it as much as they can, even the ignorant ones. You're just making a fool out of yourself as usual.

Seems people don't understand what is happening. The student loans are the next housing bubble and its about to pop. They are packaged and sold in a similar manner as mortgage backed securities were. Student loans are backed by the federal government already and defaults are rising rapidly... that's currently over 1 trillion dollars floating out there in the hands of lazy, hapless retards with a growing sense of entitlement. When investors stop buying the loans because they no longer have faith in their value, this creates a very serious problem.

From what I saw it's not about letting anyone secure easy access to easy loans, but rather helping people get into lower interest loans that are still tied in to the fucked up loans the industry was dishing out prior to the bubble bursting.

he did student loans before , he did home loans before , he did the stimulus before.

Maybe he could up with something new?

Do the people who chose NOT to get that loan a 100.000 dollar gift as well?

I know a dozen people with massive student loans. For a couple the money NEVER went toward an education. For some the money also covered food, housing, clothes, car payments, drugs. For some the jobs the education qualified for will never make the loans a good investment.

ALL of them still eat out frequently, live in nice houses/apts, party, and bitch about the debt. Conversely friends that don't have a college education are all self employed or work for small owner operated service businesses and are happy with their lives.

It all comes down to expectations ..... and grasping reality.

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I'm currently paying out of my own pocket for my education, but am considering student loans for post graduate degrees, if I choose to go so far.

I had no idea you could use student loan money for anything but your education bill and books. So, this is nothing more than a personal loan with a different name?

I know 2 people, my ex g/f being one, that used the money for down payments on houses. Basically they committed fraud.

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I had a store manager working for me that earned his MBA at night over a 4 year period. Debt free.

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Is it stated in the loans that the money must be used for certain things, books, education, maybe food/gas while you're going to college?

I ask because I really don't know, and also because it just seems absurd that they would be allowed to use the money for other things.

If they just get a check like personal loans, that is nuts. That's a broken system just asking to be taken advantage of.

how are they going to know what you spend it on? btw what you get from student loans to live on is a pittance. most of the money goes to tuition and books which continue to skyrocket upwards.

The problem with this is the way this country has gone, with out a college education you are really locked out of advancing out side of small business & self employment. This is part of the problem in the country.

Now you really can't blame kids of today for buying into the bullshit of needing these ridiculous student loans to get what is essentially a required education to work in corporate America. It wasn't like this 20 or 30 years ago to the degree it is now and business ran just fine with out their little every peon being required to have some fluff education.

My brother has a bank and a Fed program after him for not repaying student loans. Oh, and his school is after him, too, because he never paid them either.

That's kind of what I'm getting at. If it's just a check issued that you can freely spend cash on anything, that's a bad/broken system. Student loans should pay the school directly for books and classes (if that's not done so already) and the remaining balance should be placed onto a restrictive credit card that only allows for food/gas to be purchased and only in certain increments per day/week.

I think the opposite.

My generation (I'm 28) was told the following: graduate high school, go to college, get a good job. Tyler Durden was onto something.

Reality is completely different. A degree really does not mean all that much. A degree does not make you smart. And a degree is not for everyone. I can't tell you how many people I know with degrees in English, Communications, and Art History...

We now have a full generation of people, maybe even two (and soon, three,) roaming around depressed because they thought a stock degree in Party University would cure their ails. When in reality, everyone is completely different.

I won't pretend to know much about the European school system but I always thought their track system sounded pretty interesting and much more tailored than our stock "get a degree" system.

most of what is posted on gfy is sheer fantasy. take it with a grain of salt. :2 cents:

these are adults have have to pay these loans back btw. not prisoners.

anyways this thread is stupid fuck off.

Adding to this...

The whole notion of going to school until we are 22-24 and having that knowledge last us a lifetime is laughable. I just don't get it. It's an old way of thinking.

The world is changing rapidly, especially with technology and globalization. We need to be learning, testing, experimenting, and developing ourselves nonstop.

Expecting to work for 40 years behind a typewriter is no longer possible.

Eh, I think education should be free along with healthcare anyway. Issue solved, no need for loans, system fraud, or students being fucked by interest rates.

What about further self-education?

I've spent about $2,500 this year on courses, training, and other educational materials. Should that be free? If not, why not?

Yeah, skyrocketing tuition + easy/cheap/free money isn't exactly a recipe for success.

These arent people who over extended themselves. These are people whose home values went down the toilet and they are current on their mortgages. So those people can refi at a lower rate. So then they have an extra couple of hundred dollars a month. Hopefully they will spend some of that on porn :)
And I agree with 12clicks on the college loans.

My personal opinion is that an undergraduate degree should be free. Graduate degrees, I don't know...

We want professionals of this caliber in the workforce, that's certain. But, maybe this is where the student (or parents) need to start contributing to education expenses.

Ideas:

Future employers pay for the education of post graduate degrees, or part of it, and require a certain number of years worked at their company in exchange.

Serving a year in the military between graduate and post graduate for payment of the future degree.

Have the government pay the costs of the degree but the student is then required to go back and teach and an undergraduate school for a year or two, which would make the cost of picking up undergraduate degrees by the government a hell of a lot less.


Anyway, I don't have answers, just opinions. Which is why I'm posting here on GFY and not sending memos to the secretary of education :1orglaugh

While I agree that having a degree does not make you smart..Lets see how far you get trying to get anywhere in corporate America with out one. It's just like in the Military, you will never be an Officer with out college education and it's very much the same in management for any large company here in the US.

No the degree doesn't make you any better than someone with lots of experience, but the degree will get you hired over the guy that doesn't have it. I'm talking big business not mom & pop stuff of course.

Most student loans work in a way where the money actually goes directly to the school. However, many of them allow you to borrow up to a certain amount on top for "other" expenses like food, living, clothes etc.

Say for example you have $5K in tuition and another $1K in fees and you borrow $8K. The full $8K is normally paid out to the school who then takes what they are owed and will cut you a check for the remaining $2K.

A person could borrow $2-$4K per year extra so they could have an extra $8-$16K added on to the cost of tuition etc when they graduate.

Why does everyone have to be a part of "corporate America" and what's wrong with mom and pop? You are victim to the "get a degree" mantra. Small businesses offer growth opportunity, learning opportunity, and you can get in without fighting against someone that went to Harvard.

My uncle is a Major. No standard college education.

You don't need 5 degrees. You need to excel, be driven, and be "smart." Degree and drive are two totally different things.

Long ago in my pre-porn life for about 3 years I worked for a large tech company. If you wanted to move up in the ranks to anything higher than supervisor you had to have a degree. It didn't matter what it was in, but you had to have one. They also had pay grades and if you wanted to advance past a certain pay grade you had to have a degree. There were a few people I knew who were going to school just to get general studies degrees so that they could move up the company ladder.

I'm not saying anything is wrong with Mom & Pop.. I'm saying kids of today are taught they need an education to go anywhere in life and corporate America has made that a reality. The simple facts are most mom & pop business can not afford to pay what big business America can in the higher positions.

Example, my brother in law started working for UPS about 15 or 20 years ago. He started out working one of their warehouse then went to driving then worked his way into management from the ground up.

He's now one of their main regional guys and is making over $300k a year. You simply will not do that at a mom & pops place as the opportunity is just not there.

He didn't have a college degree when he started, but had to take courses to move up with-in that company while he was working. Now he learned his job as he went and slowly went up the ladder. Yet even doing that they required he go to school to get a 4 year degree, in order to move into management despite already being employed by them and having the ability to do the job.

That is pretty standard operating procedure for 99.9% of corporate America and this is what young people have to deal with when they are at the start of their career. In most cases if they choose not to go to college they will most likely not advance past a peon worker regardless if they can do their job well or not.

Personally I didn't go to college as I really didn't think it was for me. However I've always ran a business in some form or another for myself and have had very few jobs in my life.

Yea that's exactly the point I'm getting at. It's really ass backwards TBH.. You have people that can do the jobs already working for companies whom will not let them advance with-out the college education.

Granted in these kind of situations it's probably more likely they won't have $100k student loans, but it's easy IMO to see why kids today fall into that kind of trap with student loans out the ass. Added to this it's never been so expensive to go to college as it is today.

Look people, there will always be idiots that do stupid shit. We all know it, we all hate them, it's beside the fucking point. If there weren't corrupt businesses and government programs allowing them to fuck up so epically that the entire economy explodes we would not be where we are today. The reason people have 100k loans is that the schools increase prices to match the higher and higher amounts that our government guarantees for them. If someone that has ties to Washington was not getting rich on students then tuition would not cost what it does. If someone that has ties to Washington wasn't getting rich giving shit mortgages to broke people then we wouldn't have had the housing collapse either.

Education should be far more apprenticeship based than it is now. Very few careers require 4+ years of classroom education. Most students and employers would be much better off with two years of study and a two year accredited apprenticeship where the student can actually gain experience while the employer gets access to low cost labor. It would also bridge the gap between academics and employment as companies hire apprentices who prove they have the skills needed to succeed.

Colleges should be required to offer revshare based tuition. A small up front fee of a few thousand dollars and a contractual obligation by each student to have their wages garnished by a small percentage during years 5 to 10 after graduation. That would give schools incentive to have a much more robust job placement program, would give them reason to turn away or fail out students with no chance of success in their chosen careers and would lead schools that actually graduate employable people to have much larger endowments than those who do not.

40K per year at a degree factory just to keep pace with other applicants who also carry massive debt is an unwinable game, and the fact that schools want to know repackage student debt as an investment instrument is a replay of the subprime mortgage mess using student debt rather than home debt at the catalyst for another round of economic problems.

Mark Cuban wrote recently that if the government lowered the amount of guaranteed student loans down to $2,000 per term (so around $6K per year) schools would be forced to find a way to provide the service for less and they would likely be able to do it.

Like you say the cost is high because we let it get that way. The same with housing. It used to be that most mortgages were 10-15 years long and you had to bring home 3-4 times what the house payment was going to be just to qualify. Now with 30+ year mortgages and in many cases little or no income requirements people buy bigger houses and it drives the cost of every house up. It is crazy.

another refinancing...shit man ....

I've made a few million online and I dropped out of school in the 10th grade. I have $0 in school loans. I did spend 7 years in the Army but nothing in Field Artillery or Air Traffic Control taught me to use a computer and the internet was barely even starting to get popular when I got out in early '97. I've never taken a college course or continuing education class, and my business has been mostly ran by myself for the 15 years that I've been doing it.

I dont get it when people go 5 or 6 figures in debt just to go work for someone else.

You don't get it but you have to admit that some people just aren't cut out for anything but a paycheck. I have better luck paying someone $10 an hour than giving them half of something that brings in $2000 per week. They just can't deal with "risk" and no rules imposed by their masters.

It all comes down to what you want to do. I'm not sure if you were actively looking for something online or to go into business for yourself, but you ended up finding something you could teach yourself to do, you worked your ass off and made is bug success which rocks!

However, if you want to be a nurse or lawyer or engineer or accountant etc. you can't just teach yourself to do those things. With some of them you could go to work for yourself afterwards, but it also takes a certain type of person to work for themselves and everyone isn't cut out for that.

NOTHING is "Free". You're paying for it somehow...matter of fact you're probably paying for it even though you aren't going to school.

http://blogmaverick.com/2011/10/14/m...and-then-some/

#3

Pretty much all it boils down to is this:
If you want to do something, you find a way. If you dont want to do it, you find an excuse.

With the exception of becoming a doctor or lawyer, or some other highly specialized skill that requires advanced certifications, most people settle for working for other people and letting those people decide what their time is worth. I personally know people that have 6-figures of school loans to repay and they work for $40k - $50k a year.

And some of these same people, I've offered to teach them in 4 hours something that could make them $50k - $100k a year in their spare time. And they arent interested.

Just blows my mind. Most people are programmed to be worker drones. And they will pay to do it.