i completely disagree with this on rs and u2. but tbh, i am not one of the big fans of east coast rock and you very well may be right that bon jovi could continue their legacy tour without original members.

nevertheless, my op stands, it's a dickhead move to 1. fire someone for asking for a raise and 2) to bail on whatever % of your customers you've sold tickets to marketed as the original band.

It's also a dickhead move to ask for a raise during the tour. Don't you think? Sounds more like extortion and firing in that case sounds pretty good to me.

Do you honestly believe the conversation went "hey, i'd like more money".... "too bad, you're fired". Or do you think demands were made, leverage was used, ultimatums were made, probably attorneys/labels were involved, heated words were exchanged, legal threats were made and a very difficult business decision was made that no one wanted to have to make - just as much for legal reasons as for business and financial reasons?

You cant seriously be this naive about business....

again, my point is water's original contribution to the band,
pink floyd could not have replaced waters and made dark side of the moon.

and if fans are made aware of who pink floyd is made up of, and they buy tickets to see that ensemble, sure, i have no problem, but to have a battle of the egos and an original band member fired mid-tour 35 years later is not mba level business thinking.

settle down. the very first words i put in this thread were "we are all guessing" i didn't mean that for you to guess some wild ass shit about how i thought the convo went.

you went back and added this? wow. enjoy your thread.

No, i didn't. I read what L-Pink wrote and added "leverage was used".

So...........hmmm........... :)

You are guessing when you say its a dickhead move to fire someone "for asking for more money" referring to the bon jovi situation. Thats offering conclusion that assumes quite a bit. Not speculation. ;)

I think we should all quietly walk away from this before someone points out we are fighting over Jon Bon Jovie ………….

I saw this a little while back. It is a very good movie and it makes it pretty clear that in this band Jon pretty much runs everything and the rest of the guys show up and do their job.

What we don't know in this situation is how much Sambora asked for or how the negotiations went down.

I doubt he went to him and said, "I think I deserve more money." Only to have John respond with ,"You're fired!"

The documentary eludes to the fact that Bon Jovi and Sambora have had a rough relationship over the years. They fight, but eventually make up because they are both smart enough to know that they are better off with them both on that stage. I will not be surprised to see this worked out and him back soon.

Lmao!!! Thread over!!!!

I'm just defending his hair.

http://userserve-ak.last.fm/serve/_/...+Jovi+0988.jpg

All of this has been ironed out decades ago what their % was. Asking for more is an insult. Richie probably copped an attitude & Bon jovi fired him. Rightfully so.
Ds

for all we know a variation of that is exactly how it went down. we're talking out our asses about rock star egos and millions of dollars.
and that's not naivete. for all we know this was a drunken email exchange between a couple washed up rockers, in the end who gives a shit, it's not worth making comments about it personal.

all this rock star shit usually boils down to pussy anyway, prolly has nothing to do with money or old deals.

All bands are corporations. Each band member is an employee of the group that work for the corporation that is "Bon Jovi, inc". It's the same setup as the usual boy bands. With a little capital, good eyes and ears, you could hire someone to be a part of "The Tony286's", and promote that company, er, brand, just like you would any solo model of any solo model website. They get the recognition and star-power while you reap most of the $$$.

The music industry is filled with stories about bands/singers who had hit songs, sold out big world tours and were still broke because of the way the contracts were and how the companies were formed. They end up with very little and others behind the scenes get most of the money.

There is a famous story about a singer who goes into a record label (this was in the 1950's) and he tells the label president that he wants more money. His song is getting played heavily on the radio and selling like crazy in stores and he has only gotten a few hundred dollars. The label head hands him the keys to a brand new Cadillac that he drove to work that day and tells him that the car is his. The singer is very happy. This is more than he had hoped for.

After the singer leaves the room another guy who was there tells the label president how generous that was of him. The label president laughed and told him the car was a rental so the guy will get a few days of happiness from it before trouble finds him.

They're not getting rid of Bob are they? I'll have to start eating at Burger King :(

I am personal friends with Phil and Lindy (who are expecting the birth of their SON any day now ....), and Phil has been told to keep his day-planner open, and to put Phil and the Drills 'on ice' until further notice ....

Sambora sounds pretty fired to me ... and it's been a long time coming - like 6-7 years coming!! :winkwink:

No hits, there would of been not much of a business to manage. :2 cents:

We will find out the real story soon enough. Its not like a job, there are lots of lawyers involved. lol

In the documentary,they hand him the check and tell him its an advance.

http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortu...1819/index.htm
Locking up an insanely great new bass player is no small thing. For Metallica, it meant searching far and wide for the perfect guy to fill the hole left when Jason Newsted departed. The band tapped Robert Trujillo - widely considered to be one of the finest bassists in all of rock - and promptly handed him a million-dollar advance.

Some people who are referred to as dickheads, actually are dickheads. Of course it's easy to just bash anyone who makes less money than you and worship those who make more, but not everyone is a complete tool.

I make fun of people like you, not because people don't occasionally fall on hard times, or that you make little to no money,... but because you are proud of it. Further, you joke about using welfare when you don't need it, not understanding that the money you are spending came out of our pockets. You advertise in your sig, not for a career.. but for random work that you can do at home like any 3rd worlder with English as a second language does for peanuts.

There are those rowing the boat for the benefit of all and there are those dragging their feet in the water....

this i can see, if sambora has been a problem employee for 6-7 years, hell, yes, fire the guy and sort out the rest of the tour, i get that.

what i don't get, and was fun to play around with, is a 150 word news story with the only specific being- sambora asks for raise, gets fired.

Lets clear a few things up here, jackass. When you are given foodstamps or welfare, the money is placed on a benefits card. When you go off foodstamps or welfare, you CAN NOT remove ANY of the remaining money from the card! They WILL NOT take it back! I fucking tried, shitstain. Of course you wouldn't know that since you're so loaded down with cash that you can't yank yourself away from the richest message board on the internet, go fuck yourself.

So even though I haven't needed social welfare for more than a year or more now, there is still money on the card. So I use the fucking money on the card, because as a fuckwit like yourself would never know, it's illegal to give it to someone else. That's one of the MANY abuses of the system that people like you usually bitch about! Illegal and fraudulent use of welfare, paying for drugs, letting someone else use the card in exchange for crack and shit like that. Did you understand? Will the last racehorse cross the finish line at long last?

By the way, if you think spending a couple grand of welfare money from the state of NY when you really need it is spending money from YOUR pocket, you're just showing your idiocy again. I've worked and paid taxes for 40 fucking years and I have a massive extended family going back well before welfare was ever established. By the time I go outside of my OWN money paid into welfare I'd have to be on it for a dozen years!

Please try to put some effort into your trolling from here on out. Lame attempts like this are just a waste of my work time. Which you'll no doubt be overjoyed to hear (again), I'm very nicely employed and doing well.

I should add that by talking about shit I mentioned to less than 3 people regarding my past employment, you're only violating what little trust they once had in you. Congrats on that.

while Eddy is a great player I would say it's Alex's band and no, the drummer could NOT be replaced. both Eddy AND Alex are crucial to the VH sound :2 cents:

usually goers much deeper with bands... living on tour busses together for years before making any money is a breeding ground for issues that are demonstrated at latter time

I saw Van Halen in the 70's on their second tour, first headlining tour. My brother and I met the band as they exited the building. Eddy with a hot chick on each arm and a beer in hand got into the back of limo 1. David, Alex and Michael got into the back of limo 2. Just for some perspective.

It has been a lot of years since I did this type of music journalism, but, if memory serves, to record his first demo for their eventual hit Runaway, Jon Bon Jovi traded like janitorial work for studio time and I don't think Sambora contributed to that track or was in the picture at all then. As I recall, guitar was provided by someone who went on to form Skid Row or Cinderella.

I only saw the video clip where Lar's says something to the effect of 'we want you in the band and here's a check for a million dollars because that's how serious we are' ... advance or not it's a very positive statement about Robert Trujillo's future with Metallica :2 cents:

Gonna have to say that you're a bit wrong about this one. Gene and his manager Bill Aucoin were quite tight and what Gene said, Bill backed up. He might not have been doing the actual day to day "business stuff", be he most certainly was at the Helm steering the ship.

Eddie is a violent drunk who often has temper tantrums. Even at that point, they didn't want to be with him all that much. Just for some perspective.

Yes he did but Richie's work was important to the band becoming what it became.
http://mpcamusicpublishing.com/catal...ichie-sambora/
Since 1983, Bon Jovi have sold more than 120 milion albums worldwide, performed more than 3000 concerts in 50 countries before more than 36 million fans. Sambora has co-written five Number One hit singles, more than twenty Top Ten singles and nearly forty Top 40 songs, including the rock classics ?Wanted Dead or Alive,? ?Livin? On A Prayer,? ?It?s My Life? and ?You Give Love A Bad Name.? In 2006, the band?s song ?Who Says You Can?t Go Home? (co-written by Sambora and Bon Jovi) won The 2006 People?s Choice Award for ?Best Rock Song.? The country duet version of the song featuring Jennifer Nettles reigned as #1 on the Billboard Hot Country charts for two weeks (marking the first time a rock band has ever graced the top of the Country charts) and garnered CMT, CMA, ACM and Grammy nominations. The song took home a Best Collaborative Video from CMT and Bon Jovi earned their first ever Grammy Award for Best Country Collaboration With Vocals.

According to ASCAP, Jon Bon Jovi has writing credits on 398 songs and Richie Sambora has writing credits on 340. Obviously both significant contributors, but you'd need to break that down with a spreadsheet to figure out which was greater and I doubt most fans would do that. And nobody is throwing hotel room keys at Desmond Child.

Imagine, you could have used that money to help someone that needed it in any one of a 1000 ways... but you didn't. In fact, it clearly never even crossed your mind.

I would also not say "i'm loaded". I've made tons of money. I've blown tons of money. I've lost lots of money on various businesses. I've spent maybe 1/2 a million dollars just traveling. When I am running out of money, i have never found it too difficult to apply myself and start making more money. I blame myself. I believe in myself. I accept personal accountability for anything that goes wrong and I fix it. It is not difficult to make money in this business. It is not hard at all to make 5 figures a month. I make well into 5 figures a month just with PPC alone and work on it less than an hour a day. My problem is staying motivated. You post on here for years, posing as a PimpRoll employee begging for random work and defending welfare. You are supposed to be embarrassed and ashamed and it is supposed to be about lessons learned... not something you are proud of as you passively look for random grunt work with the stipulation that you can do it from the comfort of your home.

:2 cents:

In my early 20's I wrote for a music magazine. I interviewed a lot of different bands and wrote about a lot of bands. Some of them were big, or got big at the time I was writing about them, but many of there were small bands that might have a small local fan base and were struggling to build a following and find success.

If there are two things you can count on from many bands it is flakiness and ego problems.

Musicians, at their core, are artists and it is rare that you can get a group together who all share the same vision. When you struggle to succeed you fight about which direction the band should go. When you do find success there is a good chance at least a few members of the band are not going to be very happy about the type of music you are playing and it will cause problem.

I have seen many bands just on the cusp of success, some of them having been offered major label deals, break up over the dumbest shit.

Something like what is happening with Bon Jovi is no shock. Sambora co-wrote just about every hit they have had, yet it is Jon's name on the band and he is the face of the band. I bet over time Richie just got fed up with it and decided he was just as responsible for the success of the band ans Jon and wanted more money. Add money to an already volatile relationship and you have explosions.

right on! nevertheless the band became iconic with sambora contributing to that chemsitry that takes a band to that level. the guy for skid row, not so much.

no problem being off about it, after all it's a casual discussion. my point is a band is more than the sum of it's parts. it's gestalt, an amalgamation that creates something bigger. to say gene simmons was they guy that not only fostered that, but thought it up and is responsible for it discounts so many other factors, one of which is complete luck.


a few points
1. i was under the impression bon jovi was known more for it's music rather than jovi's face, l-pink reminding me that they eploded with mtv makes sense combined with the dude's good looks. that's a different story but it's not out of the question to say that they achieved their status cranking out songs with sambora writing for quite a while, the merchandising and legacy tours and $500 tickets are certainly the rewards for that .

2. re: replacing band members, my point was some bands/band members just cannot be replaced. many (most?) can, no biggie, let's take it to its logical end, can an entire band be replaced? doubtful.

can alex van halen be replaced as bassist? he's a badd ass bassist but could be replaced, how would fans react to eddie firing alex?

hmmm......... that's what im' sayin,

:1orglaugh

it's a rhetorical question, of course you can't take alex out of van halen, that's the point. but he doesn't do anything on the bass another trick bassist cannot do. the argument up to this point by some has been most anyone in a band that is not the iconic face or front man can be replaced

my point was obviously fans would flip the fuck out if eddie fired alex.

:1orglaugh