Yes they had that at my high school. I actually gamed the system and started a lawn business while I was in high school using that program. I used to take care of a lot of lawns in a old folks trailer park and the head maintenance guy used to sign all my papers for the school. I'm pretty sure the teacher knew what was up but she didn't say anything. I ended up running that business for about 10 years. I bought my first house from that business.

This is where the wishful thinking people somehow believe everyone will be granted a livable income.. Myself, I think these people will be living in tent cities..

Yes you make a very simple point that money moves. But what it gives the rich is the power of where and what the money does.

Nerd Zuckenburg decides what happens to $4,000,000,000 worth of societies assets not society, it goes to what Zuckenburg wants not what is needed.

Hence the USA, one of the richest countries in the world, your inner cities look like they were bombed, your health care is worse than Cuba, and your education system worse than Poland,

You live in a country where the majority believe in Angels !!!

What makes you think things will change in the future? Since the beginning of recorded history those who have more have sent their kids to the best schools and supplied their families with the best things. You think this will change? How so? Who in the future is going to force those with more money to send their kids to the poorest schools?

The creator of Facebook has made the money he has because society has deemed the product that valuable. Millions of people worldwide use that site and thus the creator of it has reaped the benefits of having millions of customers. If society really wanted to focus on stamping out cancer they would do it. Every person would find a group that is working to discover a cure and donate money to them. One of the problems is that instead of having one group focusing on fixing the issue there are multiple groups competing for the cure and there are entire businesses making millions raising money to defeat cancer. Personally I have more outrage over people like the Susan G. Komen foundation that raises millions for breast cancer research and only gives a tiny percentage of the money to the actual research while paying CEOs millions, flying in private jets and having offices in skyscrapers, than I do a guy who created a website and made millions from it.

You are correct that if society wanted to give every child an equal chance they could. But they don't. This isn't as much "the man" holding them down, it is them deciding what they want to do and not what to do. All over the nation cities and local districts vote down school budgets. Many people don't give a damn about their local schools. A city could easily come together, oust those who are not helping the situation and raise money to make the school as good as possible, but it is not easy. Many people simply don't care. I don't see that changing anytime soon.

You seem to have some vision that the future will be some utopian society where everyone has an equal change and the meek will inherit the earth. Why do you think this will happen when our history shows that it simply is not the case?

Tony, Not sure why you want to make this about me? However, I am a perfect example of what should happen when you use government money. And to keep it real. The GI bill is not a handout.
Anyhow, I did use the GI bill for school, and look what it achieved. I wouldn't even be in business without my engineering degree. And I wouldn't have my degree without the GI bill.

I understand how money "moves around". You do not understand. I understand "his" money is what banks are lending to people like you to buy cars, houses to fund business, investment, construction and is creating jobs and still driving the economy.

He and Facebook have paid many Billions in taxes. How many hundreds did you pay?

yep, Reagan fucked everything up and he is worshiped almost as a saint in America so we are doomed until people here start thinking differently.

What makes you think things will change in the future? Since the beginning of recorded history those who have more have sent their kids to the best schools and supplied their families with the best things. You think this will change? How so? Who in the future is going to force those with more money to send their kids to the poorest schools?

The French Revolution

The American revolution

The Russian Revolution

The creator of Facebook has made the money he has because society has deemed the product that valuable.

Society was never asked. The Cocaine cartels could say the same. The market is blind and you can make a fortune selling, burgers that destroy childrens' health, drugs or popular computer programs. It is a dictatorship of the rich.

You are correct that if society wanted to give every child an equal chance they could. But they don't. This isn't as much "the man" holding them down, it is them deciding what they want to do and not what to do. All over the nation cities and local districts vote down school budgets.

People all over the world have been struggling for social justice, equal opportunities, education and health care. Is their access to impartial independant news? Or are all main sources of information controlled by corporations?
The US working class was smashed and as seen here full of the ideas of the Ruling junta.



You seem to have some vision that the future will be some utopian society where everyone has an equal change and the meek will inherit the earth. Why do you think this will happen when our history shows that it simply is not the case?

All through the 50s and 60s the USA was a potent model for World development. Do you think that is true now?

capitalism is its own worse enemy, now it is not in competetion with the Soviets its running wild, provoking the worse economic crash in a hundred years, plus an ecological nightmare.

Either mankind controls markets or the markets will run the planet into the abyss.

It is strange how you can believe that 1% of the population can own 50% of the wealth of a nation, and yet miners, farmers, cleaners, produce vital real things and our poor their whole lives.

So you think that the Kings of feudal times could do what they wanted with "their" money? After all they were the clever ones owns holding power.

I believe the American Revolution was against that concentration of wealth and power into few hands.

If your congress which is run by the rich allows rich people to rig the system to rob the poor is it really "their" money?

When you are robbed it is still your money except you have lost it.

Americans are robbed everyday and don't even know it.

You are wrong. We know we are being robbed by the federal government and no one is happy about it either.

I won't speak on the French and Russian, but the American Revolution didn't suddenly make everything equal in the US, it just allowed us to determine our own leadership free from the British.

Society was in fact asked. The site was created and millions decided to use it. Not just that, but it was a perfect example of competition because at the time Facebook was created Myspace was the king of that space and people decided that Facebook was better and that they wanted to use it.

Had nobody used the site it would have faded away and its creator would have made nothing.

I won't argue that the US working class has been smashed. Read my first post in this thread. I say right in it one of the reasons that we have so many poor people is that wages have been stagnant for 30 years while the cost of other things has gone way up.



Pure capitalism cannot succeed, nor can pure communism, pure socialism ect. When left unregulated people will do terrible things to others for the sake of profit. I don't think it is capitalism as a whole that is the worry, it is more our banking system that allows some people to take huge risks in order to produce money out of thin air that is one of our biggest problems. When lose it can cause all kinds of problems as we saw when the economy recently collapsed.

Our society thinks of people in poverty as "defective". When you have an attitude such as this it is no wonder you don't win. You aren't identifying root causes. You aren't fixing anything. You're just throwing a little bit of money at the problem and doing nothing to prevent it from growing.

I've read many of your posts in the past and maybe I'm out of line and maybe I'm wrong but I get the feeling your question is rhetorical and like most GOP advocates you're trying to bring up the "waste of money". IOW "See we spent millions and it failed so let's stop trying to help these bums". This is another reason why things never get better. It's all attitude. No not just the impoverished but all of us. We make it fail.

I think one of the reasons few things change is that there area always differing opinions on how to change them so finding a middle ground can be very difficult.

Look at the war on the drugs. By pretty much all standards it is a failure. We have spent trillions of dollars and put millions of people in jail yet the number of kids trying and using drugs is about the same as is the number of overall users. Yet, we continue to do it and the ideas on how to maybe deal with the issues are all over the spectrum.

The same can be said with poverty. Some will say that you can solve poverty by giving the poor free education and helping them find good jobs. Others will just say to give them money and housing and take care of them. Still others will say fuck 'em, don't give them anything and it will motivate them work harder and lift themselves from the bottom.

The reality is that in a capitalist system there will always be poor people. It just works that way. The hope is that there is a way for those who want out of that situation to have a pathway out and those who are in that situation to have options so they can, at the very least, live a decent life and have access to healthcare, housing, food etc.

You asked me what makes me think things will change and I gave you the answer of radical change in the past.

People buying is not deciding the way society uses its wealth. It is just deciding how they spend their pennies.

The power of the working class was smashed = their trade unions and political parties.

Society Decided to give it to Him....

So you think that some day the poor will rise up, take the wealth from the rich and redistribute among themselves or create a society that better serves them?

It has happened in the past, it is a good idea and capitalism left on its own seems incapable of producing a staple fair society.

Exactly. You can have anything you want...if you inherit it like she did.

And btw there has been poverty since the beginning of time, Even George Washington gave speeches on it. Poverty will never ever ever go away in out lifetime. Maybe in the future when the world is like Star Trek, but not in our world.

How do poor people "take the wealth from the rich"? They break into rich peoples bank accounts and do transfers into their own or something?

poverty will always be... no fucker in the government is interested in solving the problem, poor people can't start a war, and they don't have the time to think about revolution, because they're busy with how to survive.

That is what I would like to know as well.

I guess I just prefer to try to fix some of the things that are helping to cause the problem as opposed to waiting around for a revolution that ultimately may not change much of anything.

We can fix the education system in this country. We can work on creating regulations that stop banks and some companies from just creating wealth out of thin air by doing nothing and taking massive risks that put our economy at risk. We can work to create jobs and get wages increasing again.

These are real world things that can help reduce poverty and they are things we can do now with just a little cooperation form our elected leaders.

It is of course possible. During the Cold War Capitalism tried to provide full employment, education and in most countries a free at point of use health service.

Since the 80s the movement has been in the other direction making Capitalism more unfair, irrational and unstable. I don't see the forces for reform, but I do see the posibility of revolution