Originally Posted by The Demon (Post 16850447)

So what are we arguing about? I'm still waiting on your link.

Originally Posted by epitome (Post 16845374)

That only puts borrowing at a little more than 200% of what the Treasury takes in per year. Countries in far worse shape have borrowed much more and recovered just fine (Japan immediately comes to mind).

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 16851436)

Japan did the stimulus package thing for ten years, it hasn't helped, so we tried, thats stupid

Originally Posted by dyna mo (Post 16851457)

in all fairness, you don't really know what could of/would of happened if there weren't one.

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 16851604)

in all fairness, the point is that we are using tactics that have proven failure
in all fairness, Reagan got the unemployment down and is Obama doing the same thing?

Originally Posted by dyna mo (Post 16851636)

umm, are you giving credit to obama for the economic stimulus act?

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 16851973)

Where the hell did you get that?

LMAO

Originally Posted by dyna mo (Post 16851988)

eh?

u said japs did a stim package 10 years ago with no success, therefor, our stimulus package wouldn't/didn't work.

i then said in all fairness, you don't know that it didn't work.

you said obama is doing the same thing.

i said are you giving obama cred for reit.

that's where i got it from,

hope that helps!

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 16852099)

they didn't do it ten years ago, they spend most of the 90's battling this, they did it like ten times I believe and they didn't get the results they would like
read about how they did things here http://www.aei.org/outlook/27568

I never said Obama did the stimulus, I said "we", that being the government in place at the time, and now they want to do it again

Originally Posted by nico-t (Post 16852712)

funny but sad: doesnt matter who is president. The real people in charge do what the fuck they want. Taking sides between rep or dem is completely useless. There is no taking sides when there is only one side.

Originally Posted by nico-t (Post 16852712)

funny but sad: doesnt matter who is president. The real people in charge do what the fuck they want. Taking sides between rep or dem is completely useless. There is no taking sides when there is only one side.

Originally Posted by 12clicks (Post 16852975)

yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeessssssssssssssssssss.......... ..........the puppet masterssssssssss:1orglaugh

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 16849516)

Jesus, thats the best liberal spin I have have ever heard

During Jimmy Carter's last year in office (1980), inflation averaged 12.5%, compared to 4.4% during Reagan's last year in office (1988). Over those eight years, the unemployment rate declined from 7.5% to 5.3%, hitting highs of 9.7% (1982) and 9.6% (1983) and averaging 7.5% during Reagan's administration.

During Reagan's presidency, federal income tax rates were lowered significantly with the signing of the bipartisan Economic Recovery Tax Act of 1981. Real gross domestic product (GDP) growth recovered strongly after the 1982 recession and grew during his eight years in office at an annual rate of 3.85% per year. Unemployment peaked at 10.8% percent in December 1982?higher than any time since the Great Depression?then dropped during the rest of Reagan's presidency. Eighteen million new jobs were created, while inflation significantly decreased. The net effect of all Reagan-era tax bills was a 1% decrease in government revenues when compared to Treasury Department revenue estimates from the Administration's first post-enactment January budgets. However, federal Income Tax receipts almost doubled from 1980 to 1989, rising from $308.7Bn to $549.0Bn.

During the Reagan Administration, federal receipts grew at an average rate of 8.2% (2.5% attributed to higher Social Security receipts), and federal outlays grew at an annual rate of 7.1%.

Reagan also revised the tax code with the bipartisan Tax Reform Act of 1986.


Immigration Reform and Control Act in 1986
Too bad no one has enforced that

End of the cold war
By the early 1980s, the USSR had built up a military arsenal and army surpassing that of the United States. Previously, the U.S. had relied on the qualitative superiority of its weapons to essentially frighten the Soviets, but the gap had been narrowed. After President Reagan's military buildup, the Soviet Union did not further dramatically build up its military;the enormous military expenses, in combination with collectivized agriculture and inefficient planned manufacturing, were a heavy burden for the Soviet economy. At the same time, the Reagan Administration persuaded Saudi Arabia to increase oil production, which resulted in a drop of oil prices in 1985 to one-third of the previous level; oil was the main source of Soviet export revenues. These factors gradually brought the Soviet economy to a stagnant state during Gorbachev's tenure

We havn't had a good leader since

Originally Posted by slapass (Post 16853810)

Wow where did you find that BS? The debt grew faster under Reagan then any previous president. He doubled the national debt during his tenure and Bush Sr did worse until he was forced to raise taxes. Remember the RTC, Saving and Loans crisis, destruction of real estate prices? Yeah, he was a great pres if you sold guns and ammo, otherwise he pretty much sucked.

Originally Posted by slapass (Post 16853810)

Wow where did you find that BS? The debt grew faster under Reagan then any previous president. He doubled the national debt during his tenure and Bush Sr did worse until he was forced to raise taxes. Remember the RTC, Saving and Loans crisis, destruction of real estate prices? Yeah, he was a great pres if you sold guns and ammo, otherwise he pretty much sucked.

Originally Posted by nico-t (Post 16853755)

here's how you look at the world:
http://bernie.cncfamily.com/img/blinders.gif
ignorance is bliss huh?

Originally Posted by The Demon (Post 16853954)

Wow where ddi you get this BS from? Are you even going to bother quoting your "source"?

Originally Posted by 12clicks (Post 16854258)

having not lived thru it, he's most likely sucking at the teat of liberal revisionist history websites. :thumbsup

Originally Posted by nation-x (Post 16854339)

Are you saying that Reagan wasn't President in 1981? Or that Bush Sr. didn't have the S&L Crisis or any of the other things he mentioned? Who is being revisionist in this equation?
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...4px-USDebt.png

Originally Posted by The Demon (Post 16853954)

Wow where ddi you get this BS from? Are you even going to bother quoting your "source"?

Originally Posted by slapass (Post 16853810)

Wow where did you find that BS? The debt grew faster under Reagan then any previous president. He doubled the national debt during his tenure and Bush Sr did worse until he was forced to raise taxes. Remember the RTC, Saving and Loans crisis, destruction of real estate prices? Yeah, he was a great pres if you sold guns and ammo, otherwise he pretty much sucked.

Originally Posted by 12clicks (Post 16854450)

Reagan's tax cuts spurred the economy. spurring the economy is what we need right now.
Reagan's tax cuts RAISED tax revenues (something we could also use right now)
Congress's out of control spending was the problem with Reagan's years and is also a problem now (with obama's full support)
George Bush Sr. had nothing to do with the S&L crisis
The gross debt chart you lnked to continues to go strait up under obama.

if you can't understand at least that much, get back to the drive thru window and stop posting at me. I'll only make you look stupid in the eyes of those who aren't. :thumbsup

Originally Posted by 12clicks (Post 16854251)

how could you see me when you spend your life like this?
http://ittybiz.com/wp-content/upload...under-desk.jpg

Originally Posted by directfiesta (Post 16854467)

why would he .... you don't :2 cents:

Originally Posted by nation-x (Post 16854618)

Nice pivot... you said he was being revisionist when he said that Reagan doubled the national debt... when I prove you wrong you start talking about a totally different subject. Thanks for trying to cover up your idiocracy (I know that isn't a word... it's a reference to your biography) by attempting to belittle me by saying I work in a drive thu, though. It's always amusing.

Bush Sr. was president during the S&L Crisis... that is what he had to do with it. If it happened under Obama you would say it was his fault... so don't start backpedaling now.

Originally Posted by 12clicks (Post 16854450)

Reagan's tax cuts spurred the economy. spurring the economy is what we need right now.
Reagan's tax cuts RAISED tax revenues (something we could also use right now)
Congress's out of control spending was the problem with Reagan's years and is also a problem now (with obama's full support)
George Bush Sr. had nothing to do with the S&L crisis
The gross debt chart you lnked to continues to go strait up under obama.

if you can't understand at least that much, get back to the drive thru window and stop posting at me. I'll only make you look stupid in the eyes of those who aren't. :thumbsup

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 16854561)

Just so you know, guns and ammo sales go up under democratic presidents,

I guess lowering taxes, stopping the cold war, lowering the unemployment rate, lowering inflation, these things mean nothing to you? He even lowered the price of gas by getting higher production of oil!

You must like war, paying high taxes, lots of people looking for work and paying higher prices.
Either that or you're an idiot, which is it?

Originally Posted by nation-x (Post 16854618)

Nice pivot... you said he was being revisionist when he said that Reagan doubled the national debt... when I prove you wrong you start talking about a totally different subject. Thanks for trying to cover up your idiocracy (I know that isn't a word... it's a reference to your biography) by attempting to belittle me by saying I work in a drive thu, though. It's always amusing.

Bush Sr. was president during the S&L Crisis... that is what he had to do with it. If it happened under Obama you would say it was his fault... so don't start backpedaling now.

Originally Posted by nico-t (Post 16854814)

Wow, that makes alot of sense. You need to get enlightened and see the big picture, but the older one gets the harder that's going to be. So there's no hope anymore for you, have fun in your simple minded black and white world :thumbsup

Originally Posted by StickyGreen (Post 16855446)

Damn you fucking idiots argue back and forth so pointlessly it's embarrassing. They've got us all pitted against each other as if we are each other's enemies while the real enemies have been controlling our government for decades. Snap the fuck out of it already... how can you really be that fucking blind?

You got your fucking Republican cheerleaders and your Democrat cheerleaders, as if one of those "parties" is going to save our country or something... you fools are so pathetic with your little "teams" that you represent. What happened to simply representing freedom and our country above everything else? Why not join together and oust the corruption from our government, regardless of your stupid little parties that you have been raised to believe in? Was your daddy a Democrat? Was your mommy a Republican? Is that why you will defend any fucking thing that a person from one of these stupid-ass parties says to the death?

Originally Posted by The Demon (Post 16855253)

You also failed to grasp anything 12 clicks has said..

Originally Posted by 12clicks (Post 16855328)

go away , little boy.
HE pivoted. I brought it back to original subject.
run along

Originally Posted by 12clicks (Post 16855342)

the older one gets, the less they believe in the boogie man.
how was your day job?

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 16855648)

We should be using pure intelligence and sending in drones

Originally Posted by dyna mo (Post 16856039)

this is top-secret, hush hush, keep it on the down low-

http://www.thenational.ae/apps/pbcs....702059817/1299

http://abcnews.go.com/ThisWeek/video/secret-war-9834410

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 16856332)

I knew about that stuff, I love reading about the new stuff that the military is putting out. When I was on the Submarine in the Navy, I got to play with some very top secret stuff, that was fun!

Originally Posted by TheDoc (Post 16856226)

Let's go for a Reagan top 10...

1) AIDS is a gay plague
2) Inflation
3) Spent mad money on a Star Wars Defense Plan
4) Sold weapons to Saddam Hussein
5) Sold weapons to Afghan rebels, many who are Taliban and al-Qaeda.
6) Arms for hostages and sold weapons to Iran as well, and used the money to fund an illegal war in Nicaragua
7) El Salvador aid in murdering its people
8) His deregulation created the 1989 savings-and-loan scandal
9) Amnesty for illegals
10) Reaganomics / Trickle down economics

And as a bonus, he joked about starting WW3 and made America live in fear basically the entire time.

So many reasons why I love Reagan... gota give him love for basically creating the radical right base!