Originally Posted by The Demon (Post 16850369)

http://mises.org/daily/1099
http://www.city-data.com/forum/polit...ago-their.html
http://www.dawn.com/2001/11/10/ebr11.htm
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2...apan-recession

Originally Posted by The Demon (Post 16850307)

No, it's not coming down. You see, when Reagan was president, the unemployment stats were recorded and reported differently by the BLS. So right now we're at around 16-17%. And no, it's not coming down because unemployment benefits are running out for many unemployed. That doesn't magically make them employed. Try again.

Originally Posted by The Demon (Post 16850399)

Please tell me what source you want so I don't have to google everything. I'm well aware of Japan's 20 year deflationary spiral, I just don't know what kind of source you're looking for.

Originally Posted by epitome (Post 16850402)

Link?

Let's break this down for you, too.

From the beginning of 2008 until the end, unemployment rose a total of 2.7% under the Republican president.

From February '09 until December '09 (Obama was sworn in on Jan 20th -- wouldn't be fair to hold January against him), unemployment rose 2.4% from 7.7% to 10.1%. It then fell to 9.7% in January '10.

The Republican administration shed more jobs than the Democratic one.

http://data.bls.gov/PDQ/servlet/SurveyOutputServlet

Congress has continuously extended jobless benefits since unemployment became an issue during the recession. The current extension is set to run out on Feb. 28 2010.

Originally Posted by epitome (Post 16850407)

Anything notable from the last two years vouching for that...

I tried Google and came up with nothing.

http://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1...tionary+spiral

A bunch of things saying Japan is at risk of falling into one today, but no mention of one that has lingered 20 years.

Originally Posted by The Demon (Post 16850440)

Sorry, not sure what you're talking about as the website you gave me says it's unavailable. Furthermore,

http://www.springerlink.com/content/c161t23242g24488/
http://www.zerohedge.com/article/une...ate-really-132
http://seekingalpha.com/article/1884...ls-jobs-report

Originally Posted by Agent 488 (Post 16850441)

same losers post here every day.

Originally Posted by epitome (Post 16850445)

I never disputed "reported unemployment" vs "real unemployment."

I do realize that at some time in the last 20 or maybe 30 years, they changed the way that they record.

What hasn't changed over the last TWO years is how they record those numbers.

I understand the "can't compare to Reagan" argument and never disputed that.

As for the link, it's to the government agency that tracks and reports unemployment data. IT isn't a government strong suit. :1orglaugh

Originally Posted by The Demon (Post 16850447)

So what are we arguing about? I'm still waiting on your link.

Originally Posted by epitome (Post 16845374)

That only puts borrowing at a little more than 200% of what the Treasury takes in per year. Countries in far worse shape have borrowed much more and recovered just fine (Japan immediately comes to mind).

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 16851436)

Japan did the stimulus package thing for ten years, it hasn't helped, so we tried, thats stupid

Originally Posted by dyna mo (Post 16851457)

in all fairness, you don't really know what could of/would of happened if there weren't one.

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 16851604)

in all fairness, the point is that we are using tactics that have proven failure
in all fairness, Reagan got the unemployment down and is Obama doing the same thing?

Originally Posted by dyna mo (Post 16851636)

umm, are you giving credit to obama for the economic stimulus act?

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 16851973)

Where the hell did you get that?

LMAO

Originally Posted by dyna mo (Post 16851988)

eh?

u said japs did a stim package 10 years ago with no success, therefor, our stimulus package wouldn't/didn't work.

i then said in all fairness, you don't know that it didn't work.

you said obama is doing the same thing.

i said are you giving obama cred for reit.

that's where i got it from,

hope that helps!

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 16852099)

they didn't do it ten years ago, they spend most of the 90's battling this, they did it like ten times I believe and they didn't get the results they would like
read about how they did things here http://www.aei.org/outlook/27568

I never said Obama did the stimulus, I said "we", that being the government in place at the time, and now they want to do it again

Originally Posted by nico-t (Post 16852712)

funny but sad: doesnt matter who is president. The real people in charge do what the fuck they want. Taking sides between rep or dem is completely useless. There is no taking sides when there is only one side.

Originally Posted by nico-t (Post 16852712)

funny but sad: doesnt matter who is president. The real people in charge do what the fuck they want. Taking sides between rep or dem is completely useless. There is no taking sides when there is only one side.

Originally Posted by 12clicks (Post 16852975)

yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeessssssssssssssssssss.......... ..........the puppet masterssssssssss:1orglaugh

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 16849516)

Jesus, thats the best liberal spin I have have ever heard

During Jimmy Carter's last year in office (1980), inflation averaged 12.5%, compared to 4.4% during Reagan's last year in office (1988). Over those eight years, the unemployment rate declined from 7.5% to 5.3%, hitting highs of 9.7% (1982) and 9.6% (1983) and averaging 7.5% during Reagan's administration.

During Reagan's presidency, federal income tax rates were lowered significantly with the signing of the bipartisan Economic Recovery Tax Act of 1981. Real gross domestic product (GDP) growth recovered strongly after the 1982 recession and grew during his eight years in office at an annual rate of 3.85% per year. Unemployment peaked at 10.8% percent in December 1982?higher than any time since the Great Depression?then dropped during the rest of Reagan's presidency. Eighteen million new jobs were created, while inflation significantly decreased. The net effect of all Reagan-era tax bills was a 1% decrease in government revenues when compared to Treasury Department revenue estimates from the Administration's first post-enactment January budgets. However, federal Income Tax receipts almost doubled from 1980 to 1989, rising from $308.7Bn to $549.0Bn.

During the Reagan Administration, federal receipts grew at an average rate of 8.2% (2.5% attributed to higher Social Security receipts), and federal outlays grew at an annual rate of 7.1%.

Reagan also revised the tax code with the bipartisan Tax Reform Act of 1986.


Immigration Reform and Control Act in 1986
Too bad no one has enforced that

End of the cold war
By the early 1980s, the USSR had built up a military arsenal and army surpassing that of the United States. Previously, the U.S. had relied on the qualitative superiority of its weapons to essentially frighten the Soviets, but the gap had been narrowed. After President Reagan's military buildup, the Soviet Union did not further dramatically build up its military;the enormous military expenses, in combination with collectivized agriculture and inefficient planned manufacturing, were a heavy burden for the Soviet economy. At the same time, the Reagan Administration persuaded Saudi Arabia to increase oil production, which resulted in a drop of oil prices in 1985 to one-third of the previous level; oil was the main source of Soviet export revenues. These factors gradually brought the Soviet economy to a stagnant state during Gorbachev's tenure

We havn't had a good leader since

Originally Posted by slapass (Post 16853810)

Wow where did you find that BS? The debt grew faster under Reagan then any previous president. He doubled the national debt during his tenure and Bush Sr did worse until he was forced to raise taxes. Remember the RTC, Saving and Loans crisis, destruction of real estate prices? Yeah, he was a great pres if you sold guns and ammo, otherwise he pretty much sucked.

Originally Posted by slapass (Post 16853810)

Wow where did you find that BS? The debt grew faster under Reagan then any previous president. He doubled the national debt during his tenure and Bush Sr did worse until he was forced to raise taxes. Remember the RTC, Saving and Loans crisis, destruction of real estate prices? Yeah, he was a great pres if you sold guns and ammo, otherwise he pretty much sucked.

Originally Posted by nico-t (Post 16853755)

here's how you look at the world:
http://bernie.cncfamily.com/img/blinders.gif
ignorance is bliss huh?

Originally Posted by The Demon (Post 16853954)

Wow where ddi you get this BS from? Are you even going to bother quoting your "source"?

Originally Posted by 12clicks (Post 16854258)

having not lived thru it, he's most likely sucking at the teat of liberal revisionist history websites. :thumbsup

Originally Posted by nation-x (Post 16854339)

Are you saying that Reagan wasn't President in 1981? Or that Bush Sr. didn't have the S&L Crisis or any of the other things he mentioned? Who is being revisionist in this equation?
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...4px-USDebt.png

Originally Posted by The Demon (Post 16853954)

Wow where ddi you get this BS from? Are you even going to bother quoting your "source"?

Originally Posted by slapass (Post 16853810)

Wow where did you find that BS? The debt grew faster under Reagan then any previous president. He doubled the national debt during his tenure and Bush Sr did worse until he was forced to raise taxes. Remember the RTC, Saving and Loans crisis, destruction of real estate prices? Yeah, he was a great pres if you sold guns and ammo, otherwise he pretty much sucked.