trust me, he doesn't suck my cock. I hate republicans just as much as democrats.

No not at all. It's okay to be denied coverage, dropped right before or after surgery, not covering something that was previously approved, stalling on reimbursement, and not to mention all of the collection techniques to get the money they want. Fuck the entire insurance industry as it stands. Be it today or 4 years from now, either way they're the only option in the end for healthcare. If we're going to raise taxes then implement single-payer at that point. I don't see why people haven't realized the price of healthcare is through the roof whether you have insurance or not, even the playing field and give everyone coverage. That's gotta be the cheapest option if everyone's in one collective group.

um ok Maybe Demon was right and it was me over reacting and maybe JUST maybe I took what you said out of text! I am just sick of folks that think they are better then me or others just because they have more money then I do. What you just wrote in this reply does make more since then the org post.. Maybe its my ged education :Oh crap For this I am going to say I am sorry for being a asshole and ranting on you.

Demon you're still a shit troll but at least you you were right. :321GFY :1orglaugh

And what i've learned over the years is that hard work beats pure intellect any day of the week.

Who the hell thinks they're better than you because they have more money? When has that EVER been a logical concept?

AWwww the stupid little boy lacks reading comprehension skills, how cute :)

If that were true my lawn guy would be living in this house and I would be outside mowing HIS lawn. :2 cents:

Yup, because relying on the government is a HELL of a lot better option, rofl.

I said pure intellect, as in someone who doesn't do anything with his superior IQ.

When JFK became President the wealthy paid 92% and now the rate is 38%...I think the wealthy will not suffer much to be their brothers keeper if a few percentage points are added.

So if the smart person in this example has absolutely no ambition or work ethic then I've got to assume the hard worker has absolutely no intellect. Welcome to the world of manual labor.

What's Able Body or Labor Ready paying nowadays? :1orglaugh


Oh, and Fidy!

Not sure how you reached this conclusion. I'm smarter than most of my friends, yet a lot of them are more successful than me. Inferior intellect and hard work beats superior intellect and half assed work.

Speaking of Able Body, anyone else have their wrapped hummers driving around your town too?

http://ablebodylabor200.com/wp-conte...or-200-ad2.jpg

Nothing says making money on the backs of the poor like a branded hummer :thumbsup

My point exactly. This just distributes it a little differently. :2 cents:

yeah, man, those socialists over here can't even afford going to school - let alone a doctor

but thanks for calling me cute, it's been a long time since someone did that. you almost made me blush

Yes, I am willing to pay for it. Whatever it takes. I don't want to live in a country where people suffer unnecessarily and die preventable deaths of treatable illnesses while other people own private jets. No one gets any luxuries until everyone has healthcare. As a society, to waste resources on anything else first is unforgivably immoral. If I weren't an atheist, I'd suggest there's a place in hell reserved for those who value material things over other peoples lives. And I generally hate people.

Per-capita, universal government run healthcare administration is cheaper than the current for-profit limited coverage insurance system, if we could scrap it and start over. Unfortunately kneejerk anti-government types would rather pay a $1000 "premium" than a $700 "tax".

It should be obvious that taking a price-gouging middleman out of the deal makes the product cheaper, but the slaves are too used to sucking corporate cock. They think their debt-funded middle-class lifestyle means they're the rich who are going to take the hit. They have no idea of the real wealth disparity that exists. If you have to work, don't fool yourself, you are peasant-class.

My tax bill this year is six-figures. I have no kids. I hate the wars. What do I get for my money now?

I tend to disagree. I have a strong work ethic and believe that's been a major part of providing me with some of the opportunity life has presented me with, but without superior intellect at best my hard work would probably have landed me in middle management somewhere.

I guess I'll leave it at that, don't want to get too far into semantics. That's just my opinion.

apology accepted. I am not the most eloquent typer. I say "lazy" and I mean people who choose not to work, but can. People who understand how to beat the system. The people who say well I can work 40 hours a week min wage and make $500 or sit at home and make $400 and they decide to sit at home. The people who don't try to make themselves better through education.

There is a % of the population that really needs help and then there is the other % that either doesn't try or is purposely irresponsible because they know that the govt will bail them out. I would give someone money out of my pocket if they are really trying and deserve help. I just hate knowing that some of my tax dollars are going to those people that don't deserve it.

I thought the exact same why I do now when I was in college making 10K a year waiting tables. I wouldn't call myself rich now either. I wont be making over 250 this year. Regardless of what I make I don't think as a country it is right to keep rapeing the rich to reward those that abuse the system.

If "we" as a country want to pay for people that can't afford health care, then "we" as a country should pay the bill equally. And I don't mean someone who makes 25K a year should pay the same as someone who makes 250K a year. The % of what people pay should be the same. If it is 1% of your income, then it should be 1% for everyone to pay for it. I am not opposed to making sure everyone has health care if 1. everyone pays for it fairly, and 2. the people getting free health care really need the help and deserve the help. If they choose to spend all their money on a nice car and that is why they can't afford health care then why should any of us have to bail them out for being irresponsible ?

how are those with a pre-existing condition raping the rich/being rewarded for abusing the system?

you are lumping a lot of people together.

I don't think we're arguing about anything at this point. You just stated that you have both the intellect and the work ethic, therefore it's not what I was talking about.

:thumbsup :thumbsup :thumbsup

This sums up my stance perfectly

When JFK became President the tax rate for the wealthy was 92% and it is now 38% so how would adding a few percentage points to be your brothers keeper be raping the rich?

a clear sign of civilized societies throughout the ages: those with ways and means help those who do not.

The Demon is only the second person I've added to my ignore list in my 6 plus years on GFY. The first was Stodgehill aka DiscoStu. What makes this particular situation unique is that I've never had direct message board contact with The Demon. I just can't stand reading the stupid blind partisan bullshit drool that seeps from mouth/keyboard.

So I guess you going to hell then if you don;'t give away every last penny to the poor people right not that can't afford health care? :winkwink: because if you have a nice car, a flat screen tv, money in your savings account, then you must value material things over other people's help.

I hate to tell you, but if no one could have jets, and mansions, 100K sports cars and those other luxuries then we would be a third world country. It is capitalism that enables the majority of us to work hard and strive to be successful. No one busts their ass just to make more so they have more to give away to the people who have less. If people don't strive to be successful then there is less wealth made in this country to rape to pay for the "have nots". The country as a whole would go to shit a lot worse than it is now.

Hello Socialism.

You have a problem with people who work hard "gasp" from being able to have nice things if the other 300 million people in the US can afford health care. My problem is that a lot of the people who can't afford to have health care choose not to through their own irresponsibility.

because there is a lot of people who abuse the system. Did i say ALL? no several times i said there are two groups of people, those who are irresponsible and rape the system and those who really need the help. Both groups are LARGE. If you dont think there are a large amount of people abusing the system then you have your head up your ass.

Translation: I'm a stupid, antisocial liberal who takes everything I don't agree with, as right wing propaganda, and everything I do agree with, as fact.

Thanks Young, you're an idiot:) Let me know if anyone gives a shit about your post, other than humor.

Again, another emotional argument. It's not as black as white as these emotional people make it. It's not "I want health care for all because everyone deserves it, blah blah blah". It's not that simple.

relax.


:warning

people who need help should get it.
the money collected to help them should be fairly collected. There is no justification to make only the people who make over 250K a year pay for it all and people who make 100K or 50K a year.
One way to make a civilized society to fall is to punish the people who actually contribute the most to the society, hence heading more and more to socialism.

i am not shrugging my shoulders at abuse, but it is impossible to eliminate it. medicare is one of the most successful entitlement programs ever created and they budget in 100's of millions for abuse every year.

Exact same experience here :thumbsup The UK system is far from perfect but its way better than anything available in the USA so far. Lets hope this new bill makes some improvements :thumbsup
Oh and before anyone says the UK system is free, find out about the payments Brits make to National Insurance each moth ?

If that were truly the case,it probably wouldn't break anyones heart. But you've been around long enough to know it won't pan out that way. If this law makes it all the way,the middle class will pay more for insurance and taxes. Has it ever been any other way?

Because..... they are .... euh..... Americans ?

Will has some excellent points and I agree with many of his views on the subject. People have to take some responsibility and play by the rules. However, if we can't call a spade a spade and look at the other side here then we're all hypocrites.

The wealthiest 1% of the population has more financial wealth than the bottom 95%. That didn't happen by hard work, superior intellect, or just being born lucky. That happened by gaming the system. And worse, the disparity is growing.

According to a Federal Reserve survey in 2001 the wealthiest 1% owned 39.7 percent of the financial wealth, while the bottom 95 percent owned 32.5 percent.

They did another survey in 2004 which found that the top 1 percent owned 42.2 percent, compared to 31 percent for the bottom 95 percent.

In the 2007 survey data the top 1 percent held 48.4 percent, compared to 20 percent for the bottom 95 percent. For the second straight survey, in fact, the concentration of wealth increased.

Will, you make a show of wanting to metaphorically hang those at the bottom gaming the system to get a free ride, and I agree with you there. But you can't seriously give a pass to all rich people and assume they made it to the top honestly and without trampling on the backs of people with no money and no way to protect their rights or enforce the rules to make it a fair game.

This country is not a free-loving democracy where everyone has the same opportunities. That's the bullshit line they feed everyone and we all buy it because deep down we all hope to get rich one day and live a good life. This country is more and more becoming a plutocracy--rule by the wealthy elite. Bankers, Wall St. types, CEOs of MNCs and the politicians who do their bidding enjoy the fruits of a rigged game while making their money on the backs of everyone else.

Our free market capitalist system is an illusion. The game is fixed and most buy it because they hope that one day they get to sit at the adults' table. Until there's some REAL reform there is no way to call this a free country or a market economy. What we have is a plutocracy.

Yes correct we do pay national insurance and yes some people do say things like " why should I pay for somebody else when they get sick" and I wouldent even mind at all if I never used the the NHS and was still paying my contributions at least I know the money I have paid will help somebody else when they get ill

I have nothing against the US people ..I just dont get them sometimes.. and TBH I dont know all the ins and outs of thier current system, maybe its better the way it is, maybe its not but its up to them at the end of the day of how they want thier system run

How do you know? Out of every 1 rich person I know, at least 3 have worked their asses off day and night, 12 hour days for years, to get to the top. I think the idea that the "rich cheat to become rich" is either a myth, or a really bad exaggeration.

By that logic, every country is run by the wealthy elite for the most part. This isn't really saying anything new.

Actually, while we don't have a true free market economy, up until Clinton, the government for the most part, stayed out of economic affairs. The game is NOT "fixed", unless you don't know anything about economics. The government can definitely swing it one way or another with their propaganda, but they haven't gone beyond that, although with Obama and Bernanke, we've gotten closer to real government intervention in economics than we've ever had.

Just quoting so YOUNG can see more vomit regurgitated by that idiot bibble hugger anti-porn right winger that is the Demon....LOL....

You don't have 300 million people and tens of trillions of dollars in debt (not counting social security, medicare/medicaid, and other ponzi schemes.)