Ever know somebody with a gambling addiction?

[xenigo]

A family member of mine over the past couple years has developed quite a gambling addiction. Actually, he purports to be a gambling expert... and he claims he mostly wins. Except he brings massive amounts of money to the casinos, and always leaves with nothing to show for it. He's delinquent on child support, he's lost multiple jobs because of his financial desperation (constantly asking his bosses for raises), he's taken out payday loans with interest accumulating seemingly exponentially week after week. He's about to get sued by his creditors.

All of his bank accounts have been closed, and he's being chased by the banks. He's running from the casinos now because he somehow discovered some point-of-sale loophole that allowed him to withdraw $1000 with a zero dollar balance on his bank card, while the POS had a failed terminal connection unbeknownst to the casino cashier.

He'll borrow money for gas to fill his tank, and with that $50, he runs to the casino... and loses it again. He borrows $20 for food... and loses it at the casino. Could you ever imagine someone not being able to hold onto a single dollar, without gambling it?

So I was opening some of his catastrophic mail the other day, because he didn't want to open it himself... and I said to him "heh, I get to live your life vicariously through you... and it's sort of like experiencing this train-wreck for myself..." and he got all bent out of shape for calling his life a train-wreck. Well, shit... what does he consider it then?

He used to be a big technology enthusiast, and despite the fact that he's always had a pretty decent income... he doesn't have any toys because he pawned everything to gamble. He was talking about how crappy his MVNO Android phone is, and how he'd like to buy a new one but can't afford it... I said "well, it all comes down to what you value... and you value gambling above and beyond everything." He said "I don't value gambling..." and I responded "obviously you value gambling, or you wouldn't spend all of your money on it... I don't value gambling so I don't spend my money on it. Dollars are votes of confidence." And he proceeded to get ticked off that I said that. What the fuck, right? It's like holding up a mirror to give someone an idea of what they look like... and them denying their identity.

And what I ultimately don't understand is this; If you go to the casino, and you look at the massive palatial scale of their architecture... and then you go home, and look at your shitty house, shitty car, and shitty life... could it not be any more clear who's "winning"? How do people not see it?

I've offered to teach him everything I know about SEO, and blog building... and show him ways to create content and monetize traffic. But he seems to have absolutely no interest in that. I can show him how to build an income source that would completely eliminate all of his current cash-flow problems... but he can't be bothered to pick up the phone or Skype me in for a desktop sharing session.

He'd rather drink Four Loko's and eat weed cookies. If it doesn't involve someone handing him a paycheck at the end of the week, it doesn't matter to him.

[thegreatestporn]

No more loans, let him hit rock bottom and hopefully he doesn't end up in jail. That'd stop the gambling though.

[Spunky]

My buddy is bad but not that bad,he lost about 200k and banned himself from the Casino network.he actually won 40k a few months back but they phoned the next day to say he doesn't get shit because he banned himself.he would drop a couple k in a sitting and come out with nothing

[keysync]

Fuck man that's harsh...
I do know someone like that.
It's fucking sad isn't it.
Except I don't like the person so it sort of makes me happy inside.

[baryl]

Friend of mine just can't stand if it there's a a sporting event going on that he doesn't have a bet on. He's got to be way down overall but he only bets like $30 a game so it doesn't really affect his life too much either way I've guess and I had quite a few free buffet lunches from his casino points.

[xenigo]

And I forgot to mention... his home got foreclosed on and the bank is looking for his car. This shit just never ends.

I'm not sure where rock bottom might be. Jail?

[tony286]

Used to eat at this really cool pizza place. The owner was the cook and he was so talented. One day went to eat there and it was gone. Went to the diner next store. I asked what happened next door. The owner said its a shame he had a gambling problem and he gambled everything away.

[SuckOnThis]

The absolute worse thing to happen to someone is they win a big jackpot. From that point on they are constantly chasing that high.

[Barefootsies]

My old college roommate's mother had an addiction for awhile. She racked up something like $5-10k in bounced checks, and could not seem to stop. Eventually the banks were coming after her, and if she did not pay in a certain period of time she would have ended up in court/jail/prison most likely as she had no assets to pay off that debt.

Myself, and some of our other college buddies, all pooled our money (this was a year or two after college) and we paid off the bounced checks for my friend which saved his mother. We also had the casino's basically ban her from entry (something you friend could also do).

I never understood how you could let yourself get to that point, but I guess there is some sort of "high" some people get. While I supposed I see the point in a card game with a big bet, I just can't see it in slots or whatever it was she was playing.

All the same, seems to be a hard one to break without losing it all. If you get shut out of the casinos, there is still backroom card games, lotto, lottery tickets, etc..

[xenigo]

Originally Posted by Barefootsies

We also had the casino's basically ban her from entry (something you friend could also do).

Apparently there's no way to ban a 3rd party. And he claims he's already enrolled in the opt-out program. But just as I don't believe him when he's said he stopped gambling... he's always said he's stopped gambling. There's no reason to believe he's opted out, either.

The only way I could confirm it is to bring him to the casino, and see what happens.

But until then, I'm certainly not taking his word for it...

[Barefootsies]

Originally Posted by xenigo

Apparently there's no way to ban a 3rd party. And he claims he's already enrolled in the opt-out program. But just as I don't believe him when he's said he stopped gambling... he's always said he's stopped gambling. There's no reason to believe he's opted out, either.

The only way I could confirm it is to bring him to the casino, and see what happens.

But until then, I'm certainly not taking his word for it...

Well, he could actually be "opted-out" for a year or whatever. He could be not lying.

However, I have been in casinos where people have done this, and they simply stop using their card. The one where they give you a 'rating' and track you play for the free comps and shit. Meaning, they do not show up in the system, and it's up to the floor manager or security to spot them. Which they occasionally they do.

I remember in the past year I was playing with a loud mouth Korean who enjoys telling you how to play every hand. He was apparently a regular who was in there all of the time, bouncing checks, bankrupted his business, and eventually banned himself for a year. All the same, he would still come in. They recognized him, and said, sir could you please come with us and he took off running. When I asked what that was all about, they said he had banned himself, and was not allowed on the property.

I guess he keeps sneaking in, and when approached he just takes off running.

[papill0n]

hes addicted

he has a massive problem

he cant stop

he needs an intervention

[xenigo]

Originally Posted by papill0n

hes addicted

he has a massive problem

he cant stop

he needs an intervention

We've intervened. We've cut him off. We've said it has to stop. Managed his money. Etc, etc.

The only thing left is to put the shackles on him, and put a ball gag in his mouth... and feed him intravenously. Maybe put him on a leash so he can run around in the backyard...

[raymor]

You talked about holding up a mirror. He probably will not be able hear anything you say. At the right time, when something deeply painful happens, he might just be able to hear someone who can share from personal experience - someone who has been through the same problem and come o out the other side. Someone from Gambler's Anonymous, for example, may be able to "speak his language".

[Barefootsies]

Any cleaned up addict will tell you that until that person is ready to stop, you will never get through to them. You can keep taking shit away, and hope that you "force" that light to off in their head, but that is a long shot. Ultimately their success of failure will reside with them, and their choices.

You can read it from any reformed celeb like Robert Downey, to your local crackhead. Until they want to stop, or see a value in stopping, you will never get them too. The intervention mess is just trying to force that realization.

[xenigo]

Originally Posted by raymor

Someone from Gambler's Anonymous, for example, may be able to "speak his language".

Oh yeah, and I forgot to mention he was enrolled in counselling, and refused to go.

And enrolled in Gambler's Anonymous... and refused to go to that, too.

Footsies... yeah, I know he can't be forced to clean himself up. It's a choice he'll have to make on his own. We have tried to encourage the cleanup effort. It's interesting seeing it all unfolding before your very eyes... and even being able to predict it all before it happens. I gave him a bit of a lesson on "how to avoid getting fired", and I told him not to bring his personal life to work... because that's why he got let go previously. What did he do? Go right back to begging for raises, waving his pitty-flag... putting his financial desperation right in his bosses face. And he got let go again. As I predicted.

Anyway... it's like the never-ending wreck. All you can do is watch, and have a little chuckle.

[papill0n]

Originally Posted by xenigo

We've intervened. We've cut him off. We've said it has to stop. Managed his money. Etc, etc.

The only thing left is to put the shackles on him, and put a ball gag in his mouth... and feed him intravenously. Maybe put him on a leash so he can run around in the backyard...

yeah ultimately if someone with an addiction doesnt want to stop there is absolutely nothing you can do. i think they only use the leash for junkies dunno about gamblers lol . goodluck with it all - hopefully family/friends wont let themselves get taken down with him,

[Tijuana_Tom]

You need to keep your distance from this family member and warn other family members.

He can't be helped. A Gambling adddict thinks they are smart.

At least a alcoholic or a drug addict has their health to consider. They can see and feel the side effects to their addictions.

Gambling addict says it's "Just money."

It's not until their legs and life are being threatened by the yakuza. Even then... it's too late so they care even less...

[Forest]

short of an intervention there isnt much you can do. His bottom is his bottom and everyone's is different some are worse than others

[Barefootsies]

Originally Posted by Tijuana_Tom

At least a alcoholic or a drug addict has their health to consider. They can see and feel the side effects to their addictions..

Indeed. It is just a question if you will end up getting sober before your body gives out.

[DTK]

Originally Posted by thegreatestporn

No more loans, let him hit rock bottom and hopefully he doesn't end up in jail. That'd stop the gambling though.

It's true. People giving him money are just enabling and prolonging the situation. People don't get help with their addictions until they 1) admit they have a problem and WANT help and/or 2) they hit rock bottom.

keep in mind - gambling stimulates the same brain regions as cocaine and heroin.

anyhow, at some point you, Xenigo, have to walk away from him.

[xenigo]

Originally Posted by DTK

It's true. People giving him money are just enabling and prolonging the situation. People don't get help with their addictions until they 1) admit they have a problem and WANT help and/or 2) they hit rock bottom.

keep in mind - gambling stimulates the same brain regions as cocaine and heroin.

For sure. Fortunately I've only put $20 down that toilet. He'll readily say "I have a problem... I want to get help..." but saying it and doing it are entirely different. I have a feeling he only agrees with everyone to make people around him feel better, or to try to diffuse the situation... and lessen the scrutiny.

He'll tell you he has a problem... as he's throwing $100 bills into the slot machine. His words mean pretty much nothing.

[CyberHustler]

I did, it was fucked up. Many years ago I staying with an old Filipino lady in Florida who had a gambling addiction. We agreed to split the bills in half, I would just give her my half and assume she paid the bills. She was just gambling all the money away on casino boats all day acting like she was at work. Luckily I saved money so by the time it was time eviction notices came and the lights were cut off I was just moving into my own place. I let her stay with me, but within a week she disappeared with a bunch of my shit never to be seen again. Fucking bitch...

[xenigo]

Originally Posted by CyberHustler

I did, it was fucked up. Many years ago I staying with an old Filipino lady in Florida who had a gambling addiction. We agreed to split the bills in half, I would just give her my half and assume she paid the bills. She was just gambling all the money away on casino boats all day acting like she was at work. Luckily I saved money so by the time it was time eviction notices came and the lights were cut off I was just moving into my own place. I let her stay with me, but within a week she disappeared with a bunch of my shit never to be seen again. Fucking bitch...

Wow, that's really fucked up. I had a similar situation with a roommate I had when I originally moved to San Francisco. I was paying $1000 a month for this bedroom in North Beach... and paying something like $40 on top of that for the DSL bill. Went to go update my sites one day, and I couldn't connect. Told the roommate I was going to call tech support, and he said "I already called tech support... they said they're handling it. Don't call." Waited 24 hours... told him I really fucking needed to call tech support because I was still not able to connect. He got pretty ticked off that I wasn't accepting his story, and told me not to call. Anyway, I started looking around for other places to live because I couldn't bring my desktop to a coffee shop. On the day I came back to the house to load my stuff in my car, to move into the new place... I found an eviction notice taped to the door for non-payment. It said he hadn't paid rent in over 3 months.

That was a real "holy shit" moment. Made me wonder where my money went...

[DTK]

Originally Posted by xenigo

For sure. Fortunately I've only put $20 down that toilet. He'll readily say "I have a problem... I want to get help..." but saying it and doing it are entirely different. I have a feeling he only agrees with everyone to make people around him feel better, or to try to diffuse the situation... and lessen the scrutiny.

He'll tell you he has a problem... as he's throwing $100 bills into the slot machine. His words mean pretty much nothing.

You just nailed it. That's exactly why you have to walk away.

What i'm saying applies to any addiction

[DTK]

Something I've learned is that medical science is starting to show that most addicts are born with brain chemistries that are 'off'. For the vast majority of addicts, it's not a 'weakness of character' sort of thing. It's simply a brain chemistry issue.

[georgeyw]

A mate many years ago started working for a construction company and all of the workers were pretty intense gamblers. He ended up gambling non stop, losing his car / girlfriend and in the end his job. Lost track of him after that.

I have found drug addicts to be far worse, their behaviour goes beyond insane when they are out of whatever it is they need. Then after years of taking drugs they are contstantly nuts and cause all kinds of havoc. Actually experiencing someone like this in my life right now

[tical]

My buddy had a severe gambling problem. Spent everything he had in the bank. Even sold his car as a last resort to "make some money back" from the casinos.

Having no money and no car left him to hanging around with a shitty group of friends that he normally didn't hang with that much (they were all broke / losers). Anyway, a few years later he's strung out on meth very bad.

When I say bad, I mean, to the point he thinks the government and everyone is out to get him. He hears voices. He moved out of this place he was staying at because he said his roommates could read his mind. Crazy shit. Pretty sad, he was a really good friend.

This is the only time I'd ever wish to have a friend get locked up for at least a year or two. There's no way he's getting sober without some kind of forceful intervention.

[DTK]

Originally Posted by tical

...
Having no money and no car left him to hanging around with a shitty group of friends that he normally didn't hang with that much (they were all broke / losers). Anyway, a few years later he's strung out on meth very bad.

When I say bad, I mean, to the point he thinks the government and everyone is out to get him. He hears voices. He moved out of this place he was staying at because he said his roommates could read his mind. Crazy shit.
....

That's what smoking swimming pool chemicals will do for ya

[raymor]

Originally Posted by xenigo

And I forgot to mention... his home got foreclosed on and the bank is looking for his car. This shit just never ends.

I'm not sure where rock bottom might be. Jail?

The foreclosure is current? In that case this may be exactly the right time, or maybe just after they actually remove him from the house. Don't loan him any money, not $10, but when he comes to you desperate be ready to call in a friend who has been there and done that. It's sad, but utter and complete desperation is normally required for addicts. Until that time, most attempts to help will either a) enable them to continue or b) spoil the opportunity to be helpful later, when they are ready - desperately ready.

I work with a lot of alcoholics and drug addicts - there have been hundreds by now. I never say much to one who isn't more or less completely broken. Until then, I can only say "if at some point you ever decide it has become a problem and you'd like to stop, come talk to me." I never tell them they have a problem. They have to decide that themselves.


Once they are ready, completely ready, I can tell them my story only up until the moment I quit. I talk about the crazy shit I did and they discover that I "get it". They may say to you "you don't understand" and that's true, you don't. So I tell my story in a way that let's them know I've been there. Then THEY have to ask how I quit.

[DTK]

Great post raymor

[bigluv]

Extricate yourself from the situation. Addicts are busy digging themselves a hole and will drag you in just like you try to pull them out, without any ill will. You cannot save anyone that's still digging.

I don't know that its a fact, but I saw some info one time that suggested studies had found a link between hitting a reasonably sized jackpot early on in life and gambling addiction later. That might be of some comfort to you.

[webgurl]

The "high" you get from gambling is no different from drugs/drinking etc...
It is a VERY difficult battle and it is a total mental behaviour. I feel like I have a gambling issue with live poker games.

[xenigo]

Good post Raymor. The foreclosure was completed about 6 months ago.

[xenigo]

Originally Posted by webgurl

The "high" you get from gambling is no different from drugs/drinking etc...
It is a VERY difficult battle and it is a total mental behaviour. I feel like I have a gambling issue with live poker games.

Well, I certainly enjoy alcohol... love the feeling, love the buzz... but it doesn't have me by the balls. I can have 1 or 2 drinks per night and feel just dandy. My brother on the other hand will consume half the bottle of vodka, and then drink the six pack of beer I had in the fridge... and then want to go the bar, and then the liquor store afterwards. And that would be a $100+ evening... and he wonders where his money goes.

I don't allow him to come over to my house for exactly that reason, except on rare occasions. And before he even comes in the door, I have to tell him that there won't be any alcohol consumed while he's here.

Maybe his next job should be to do the reality TV circuit... television is always looking for the next wreck.

[meka2003]

u need to show him a link to this thread

[wehateporn]

Addicts can become incredibly successful if they become addicted to something that's actually productive. If you can get him addicted to seeing online sales come in that could start to replace his current addiction, it's a shame he's shown no interest so far.

[smutnut]

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow...191619543.html

That's Dad!!!

[skywalkeer]

my buddy lost it all, but still gambling whenever he get some cash

[Chosen]

Don't know anyone with a gambling addiction...

[sperbonzo]

I'll give you 4 to 1 that I don't know anyone that is addicted to gambling....





.

[PR_Glen]

Originally Posted by SuckOnThis

The absolute worse thing to happen to someone is they win a big jackpot. From that point on they are constantly chasing that high.

a long time ago i used to work in this machine shop. was a pretty shitty job but had to pay down the cc bills so had to do it. worked next to this older woman. we reamed out machine parts on a drill press for 9 hours a day. elbows deep in oil and grit, boring as shit. She was there for ten years before i was there doing that exact same thing. Found out later that she is the factory owners older sister. She walked into a casino for the first time and won 25k on one of her first pulls. She went back the next week and lost, went back during the week and lost more.. weeks months go by, she is not only down the 25k but she put a second mortgage on her house to try to win back her money.. she ended up losing the house and her job and had to work for her brother for 10$ an hour...

won of the saddest and confusing stories i have ever heard, i have a feeling she is still there today if she's still alive..

[Rochard]

I have a friend of mine who is like this.

Years ago a friend of mine started dating a good looking former US Marine, and we quickly hit it off. However, the more she dated him the more secrets came out. Turns out he was married twice and had a total of four kids and a huge gambling addiction. She thought he was cheating on her, but it turns out he would lie to her and go out gambling. He would spend all of his money gambling, and they lived off of what she made. They've been on and off again for twenty years now, and have a ten year old kid.

But his gambling addiction causes him to spend all of his money on it. It's insane.

[fitzmulti]

That's a very rough thing to deal with. I have a friend with the same addiction, and although it's not a bad as the initial post here...it's still a long nightmare for him.

[Tom_PM]

Never known anyone personally who had that addiction. I went to a casino once in Atlantic City with a group from work back in the 80's and had fun. I began the trip with $70 earmarked for playing slot machines and that's what I did. It was spending money. There was no "omg I'm gonna win!" in my head at all. The goal for me was to enjoy the day and I did.

One of my brothers is a dealer in AC these days. Can only guess how many people he's watched spend their last dime to lose at his tables. Thousands?

[kane]

My dad was for years. I don't know him really well, he hasn't really been in my life since I was five years old, but my mom tells me that when she and he first got together and got married he would go to the track and bet on the horses all the time. At that time it was no big deal and he said it was just something he did for fun.

Then along came my brother and I. My dad would get paid from work, give my mom $50 out of his check and then got lose the rest at the track. Eventually my mom got sick of the fact that he made good money and yet she paid for everything including his car payment and gas for him to get to work because he was always gambling his money away.

She finally got so fed up she sat him down and told him he either needed to choose his family or gambling. He chose gambling. They got divorced and we moved to a different state.

I guess for the next 10+ years things were bad for him. He did make his child support payments, but he had a very good job yet had a shitty car and lived in a tiny studio apartment and even moved in with his parents for a little while.


I don't know what changed in him, but eventually he brought himself out of it. About 10 years ago I spent a little time with him and while he still reads the racing news and watches it on TV he hadn't made a bet in many years so it looks like he finally got things under control.

[xenigo]

Originally Posted by wehateporn

Addicts can become incredibly successful if they become addicted to something that's actually productive. If you can get him addicted to seeing online sales come in that could start to replace his current addiction, it's a shame he's shown no interest so far.

The other day I took him to go run my vending route with me. Zero interest there too...

[mikesouth]

First of all if he does get treatment youd do well to get him to someone who knows the difference between an addiction and a compulsive behavior.

Porn, Gambling, Internet arent addictions

heroin, alcohol, nicotine are addictions

you damn sure don't treat them the same

unless yer an idiot...

[Vapid - BANNED FOR LIFE]

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