Shouldn't we all be equal?

[SmutHammer]

Everyone is bitching about tax cuts for the rich...

We were all born in or live in America, Some of us more successful than others. Some were born into money because their parents/grandparents or whatever worked hard and were successful.

Wouldn't it be fair for everyone to pay the same amount of taxes to the government? fuck the % of money you make, Everyone should pay the exact same dollar amount, Then we would truly all be treated fair and equal

[davethedope]

that's a pretty stupid notion you've got there.

[SmutHammer]

Originally Posted by davethedope

that's a pretty stupid notion you've got there.

please explain why?

[Wizzo]

No, life was never meant to be equal and never will be.

[Wizzo]

So what would that amount be? $15,000 $20,000 $50,000? I don't think average or poor people will see that as very equal anyways...

[sperbonzo]

Or just use sales tax. Then as rich people spend huge amounts, they will pay huge amounts, poor people don't buy as much, so they don't pay as much.




.

[davethedope]

Originally Posted by Ed Hammer

please explain why?

Well, it depends on what you mean by equal .

If you mean, like a flat income tax, that's absurd.

If you mean, the same as in same rate, or percent of income, that's reasonable, but it would only seem to be "fair" or "equal", but it wouldn't be.

[grumpy]

Originally Posted by Ed Hammer

Everyone is bitching about tax cuts for the rich...

We were all born in or live in America, Some of us more successful than others. Some were born into money because their parents/grandparents or whatever worked hard and were successful.

Wouldn't it be fair for everyone to pay the same amount of taxes to the government? fuck the % of money you make, Everyone should pay the exact same dollar amount, Then we would truly all be treated fair and equal

please define whats fair in your opinion.

[SmutHammer]

Originally Posted by sperbonzo

Or just use sales tax. Then as rich people spend huge amounts, they will pay huge amounts, poor people don't buy as much, so they don't pay as much.




.

They already do this.

Originally Posted by davethedope

Well, it depends on what you mean by equal .

If you mean, like a flat income tax, that's absurd.

If you mean, the same as in same rate, or percent of income, that's reasonable, but it would only seem to be "fair" or "equal", but it wouldn't be.

You went to school, opened up a business worked very hard and made a decent amout of money.

I dropped out of the same school, sat home or whatever, collected welfare, or maybe just went and got a decent job working in a factory.

Please explain why it's fair that we pay a different amount to the government? We both were born here, we both went to the same school....

[BlackCrayon]

its a pretty sad state of affairs when the guy making 10 mil via his corp pays less % of taxes than the average working making 40-50k.

[CaptainHowdy]

[Robbie]

You have a good point actually. Which is why income tax was unconstitutional until the beginning of the 20th century.
It would still be unconstitutional...except Congress ammended the constitution to MAKE it legal. lol

Imagine that. And now they are spending nearly 7 MILLION dollars PER MINUTE. http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_1...82-503544.html

[sandman!]

[SmutHammer]

Originally Posted by BlackCrayon

its a pretty sad state of affairs when the guy making 10 mil via his corp pays less % of taxes than the average working making 40-50k.

He might pay less % but it's a hell of alot more $$$

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by Ed Hammer

He might pay less % but it's a hell of alot more $$$

Yep, and you know what he gets for his much larger amount of money into the system? Not one damn thing more.

Most of the money goes to pay for our military that is all over the world.

[BlackCrayon]

Originally Posted by Ed Hammer

He might pay less % but it's a hell of alot more $$$

is the average workers money worth less or something? if we are going to be paying % it should be the same % across the board. however i am more in favor of a high sales tax and no income taxes at all.

[davethedope]

Originally Posted by Ed Hammer

You went to school, opened up a business worked very hard and made a decent amout of money.

I dropped out of the same school, sat home or whatever, collected welfare, or maybe just went and got a decent job working in a factory.

Please explain why it's fair that we pay a different amount to the government? We both were born here, we both went to the same school....

You have to be consistent with your examples. Is the guy collecting welfare or is he working a decent job? Those are two different scenarios.

Simply put, the more you take, the more you are required to put back in.

Otherwise, there's going to be an enormous deficit- which there already is.

[London Banker]

Originally Posted by Ed Hammer

fuck the % of money you make, Everyone should pay the exact same dollar amount

So a guy making $50k/year should pay the same amount as a guy making $10mil/year?

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by davethedope

Simply put, the more you take, the more you are required to put back in.
.

Did you really mean to put the word "TAKE" there? Nobody is "taking" anything. Just ask everyone that works their asses off to EARN money.

Then the feds take it and funnel it back to their cronies in their home states and make them rich while the rest of the money goes to fund our out of control military.

The reason there is a federal deficit is because of SPENDING too damn much.

In case you didn't see where I posted how much the feds are spending: 7 MILLION dollars PER MINUTE. http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_1...82-503544.html

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by London Banker

So a guy making $50k/year should pay the same amount as a guy making $10mil/year?

I think the point he is making is...Yes. The guy who is smarter and faster than you shouldn't be penalized for just kicking more ass in life. UNLESS he gets millions of dollars back in services from the federal govt.

But he doesn't. He gets no more than you do with your 50K a year. And quite frankly...neither of you are getting much back from the feds. You get much more in services from your local govt.
The feds are too busy invading other countries and making their buddies back home rich with tax money.

[SmutHammer]

Originally Posted by davethedope

You have to be consistent with your examples. Is the guy collecting welfare or is he working a decent job? Those are two different scenarios.

Simply put, the more you take, the more you are required to put back in.

Otherwise, there's going to be an enormous deficit- which there already is.

why should it matter what the guy does? I'm talking about everyone being treated equal, no matter what they do.

But at leaste after this question, you supplied a real reason why you don't think it would be fair.

Originally Posted by London Banker

So a guy making $50k/year should pay the same amount as a guy making $10mil/year?

Yes, Why should it be different? the guy paying more isn't even using government services...


My point is that if people were treated equal, there would be no %, it would be $X per year...

Edit: as an example, people making over $250K a year pay an extra tax for Obama care, ummm..... they are not even the ones that need it....

[GrantMercury]

Originally Posted by Ed Hammer

Everyone is bitching about tax cuts for the rich...

We were all born in or live in America, Some of us more successful than others. Some were born into money because their parents/grandparents or whatever worked hard and were successful.

Wouldn't it be fair for everyone to pay the same amount of taxes to the government? fuck the % of money you make, Everyone should pay the exact same dollar amount, Then we would truly all be treated fair and equal

No. We need a graduated income tax. You can't tax the first $30,000 at the same rate as income over $1,000,000

How do you live when the government takes 25% of your $30,000? When they take 25% of $1,000,000, one can still get by quite well. The first $40,000 is far more precious to you, and necessary for life, than the last $40k any one of the Walton family (Walmart) takes in. That's why we need the graduated income tax.

[GrantMercury]

Originally Posted by Ed Hammer

the guy paying more isn't even using government services...

The rich use more of the commons - and the UNITED States of America has facilitated, and protects their fortune. Nobody got rich on a deserted island. Nobody would stay rich on a deserted island.

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by GrantMercury

The rich use more of the commons - and the UNITED States of America has facilitated, and protects their fortune. Nobody got rich on a deserted island. Nobody would stay rich on a deserted island.

What does that mean "commons"?

And nobody is poor on a deserted island too. The analogy is just foolish.

[davethedope]

Originally Posted by Ed Hammer

why should it matter what the guy does? I'm talking about everyone being treated equal, no matter what they do.

But at leaste after this question, you supplied a real reason why you don't think it would be fair.




Yes, Why should it be different? the guy paying more isn't even using government services...


My point is that if people were treated equal, there would be no %, it would be $X per year...

Edit: as an example, people making over $250K a year pay an extra tax for Obama care, ummm..... they are not even the ones that need it....

Again, simply put, a flat tax will either be too low or too high.

The distribution of wealth is too inequal.

Equality is a mathematic principle. It doesn't apply to anything else.

Unfortunately there are politics at work here, surely, and that leads to all the faulty reasoning.

Rest assured, the US has the luxury of operating with loads of debt- just expect more cronyism as a result.

[davethedope]

Originally Posted by Robbie

What does that mean "commons"?

And nobody is poor on a deserted island too. The analogy is just foolish.

Labor and resources- unless you want to outsource the US economy to China.

[L-Pink]

In order for this to work everyone's share would have to be determined by the lowest wage earner. Or you would do what, put those that couldn't pay in debtor's tax prison?

.

[AsianDivaGirlsWebDude]

Originally Posted by GrantMercury

No. We need a graduated income tax. You can't tax the first $30,000 at the same rate as income over $1,000,000

How do you live when the government takes 25% of your $30,000? When they take 25% of $1,000,000, one can still get by quite well. The first $40,000 is far more precious to you, and necessary for life, than the last $40k any one of the Walton family (Walmart) takes in. That's why we need the graduated income tax.

A progressive tax makes more sense to me than regressive taxes, such as the various flat
tax plans that get floated every election cycle.

What needs to occur is a lessening of the loopholes which undermine a fair progressive tax system.

ADG

[grumpy]

Originally Posted by Robbie

You have a good point actually. Which is why income tax was unconstitutional until the beginning of the 20th century.
It would still be unconstitutional...except Congress ammended the constitution to MAKE it legal. lol

Imagine that. And now they are spending nearly 7 MILLION dollars PER MINUTE. http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_1...82-503544.html

this one is better

http://www.usdebtclock.org/

[Freaky_Akula]

Taxation should be used for one thing and one thing only: to fund a limited government that protects your life and property against criminals. It should not be used to fund a giant army. It should not be used to bail out failing corporations. It should not be used redistribute wealth!

[epitome]

Originally Posted by sperbonzo

Or just use sales tax. Then as rich people spend huge amounts, they will pay huge amounts, poor people don't buy as much, so they don't pay as much.




.

Amen. Just collect 15% or whatever on every purchase. No other federal taxes.

[Barry-xlovecam]

Originally Posted by sperbonzo

Or just use sales tax. Then as rich people spend huge amounts, they will pay huge amounts, poor people don't buy as much, so they don't pay as much .

Oh noes -- a consumption tax. I don't want to pay that on my new yacht -- the poor guy should pay too on his medicine ~!

Never happen in Amerika where all men are created equal ( expect some ...)

[davethedope]

Originally Posted by grumpy

this one is better

http://www.usdebtclock.org/

not by much because that article is pretty retarded.

[adendreams]

This thread is now taking the intellect of GFY to a new low...depressing

[SmutHammer]

Originally Posted by adendreams

This thread is now taking the intellect of GFY to a new low...depressing

But we can see how many Gfy'ers don't think people should be treated equal, I guess the only time is when it suits them

[AsianDivaGirlsWebDude]

When the OP says equal he is only referring to an equal percentage of income tax.

What would happen instead if we took all of the money and distributed it equally - what would each share be? That would make everything equal, then we could all pay an equal amount of taxes for the common welfare. That sounds fair...



ADG

[potter]

Originally Posted by epitome

Amen. Just collect 15% or whatever on every purchase. No other federal taxes.

How do you decide what percent goes to state, and what percent goes to feds?

I love how simple people try to make this countries economic situations.

Robbie says cut military spending, it's just that easy. Cut arms R&D? The military purchases all its arms from private companies, so then all those companies lose money / collapse / fire people. Cut arms production? Same thing with R&D, and we also lose out on all the arms we sell to other countries. Cut back on personnel? Unemployment skyrockets as millions of soldiers are instantly thrown back into population.

Taxes should only be used to fund police and small gov, no armies. We'd all be speaking German now if that were the case. Or what about the roads, I bet you enjoy those? What about your internet, that wouldn't have been around without the .gov. Or what about .. Screw it it's pointless. This is GFY. Everything is simple. derp derp derp

[adendreams]

Originally Posted by Ed Hammer

But we can see how many Gfy'ers don't think people should be treated equal, I guess the only time is when it suits them

Ed your supposed "insider" opinion on health care just lost all credibility with this absurd thread. I mean the health care thing was dumb but your ideas about taxes are just flat out crazy..... BUT you're a cool guy and still think of you as a bro.. you were just unlucky when it comes to the geography of where you were raised thats all.. I bet if you were born on the west coast you would have a whole different outlook on all this shit and you would be a way cool guy.

[_Richard_]

Originally Posted by AsianDivaGirlsWebDude

When the OP says equal he is only referring to an equal percentage of income tax.

What would happen instead if we took all of the money and distributed it equally - what would each share be? That would make everything equal, then we could all pay an equal amount of taxes for the common welfare. That sounds fair...



ADG

considering all the wars fought in corporations names, that seems way more than fair

[keysync]

Last I heard most of the cities in your Wonderland of a west coast were going bankrupt.

[_Richard_]

Originally Posted by sperbonzo

Or just use sales tax. Then as rich people spend huge amounts, they will pay huge amounts, poor people don't buy as much, so they don't pay as much.




.

aren't you in finance?

[directfiesta]

Originally Posted by potter

.

Robbie says cut military spending, it's just that easy. Cut arms R&D? The military purchases all its arms from private companies, so then all those companies lose money / collapse / fire people. Cut arms production? Same thing with R&D, and we also lose out on all the arms we sell to other countries. Cut back on personnel? Unemployment skyrockets as millions of soldiers are instantly thrown back into population.

Are you telling me that government creates job & wealth ????

I tought that was the exclusivity of the private entrerprises, mainly with the trickle down following tax cuts ....

[Vapid - BANNED FOR LIFE]

What's America? Run way ?

[arock10]

All this talk of equal shares makes me think of communism

[_Richard_]

Originally Posted by arock10

All this talk of equal shares makes me think of communism

that's funny, all this talk about cutting the defense budget and all those jobs being lost made me think of communism too

[oppoten]

We had the Poll Tax flat rate per capita local government tax here in the UK. Didn't end well

[papill0n]

Originally Posted by Ed Hammer

Everyone is bitching about tax cuts for the rich...

We were all born in or live in America, Some of us more successful than others. Some were born into money because their parents/grandparents or whatever worked hard and were successful.

Wouldn't it be fair for everyone to pay the same amount of taxes to the government? fuck the % of money you make, Everyone should pay the exact same dollar amount, Then we would truly all be treated fair and equal

i wasnt born in not do i live in america

try to remember that on the internet there are many people from many lands

yay for sesame street !

[SmutHammer]

Originally Posted by adendreams

Ed your supposed "insider" opinion on health care just lost all credibility with this absurd thread. I mean the health care thing was dumb but your ideas about taxes are just flat out crazy..... BUT you're a cool guy and still think of you as a bro.. you were just unlucky when it comes to the geography of where you were raised thats all.. I bet if you were born on the west coast you would have a whole different outlook on all this shit and you would be a way cool guy.

This thread is just fucking around with how people bitch about % of tax paid, when they don't even pay close to the amount of taxes that the person with the lesser % pays, just fucking around making a small point.

As far as Health care, I have not lost any cred on that, I'm still right. Your calling what I'm saying dumb without having knowledge of whats going on... really?

Dude, you know me. Call me on the phone or send a msg. I have no problem talking to you and letting you know what I'm talking about.

Originally Posted by papill0n

i wasnt born in not do i live in america

try to remember that on the internet there are many people from many lands

yay for sesame street !

Sorry was mainly aimed at the people in the USA bitching about how much Romney pays in taxes

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by GrantMercury

The rich use more of the commons.

Originally Posted by Robbie

What does that mean "commons"?

Originally Posted by davethedope

Labor and resources- unless you want to outsource the US economy to China.

Okay...now this sounds kinda dumb to me.

The argument about "the rich use more of the commons" you are saying that means that they employ people and buy goods (labor and resources)?

Isn't that a GOOD thing? And for that..everybody thinks that they should not only pay more in actual dollars (MUCH more...even with a flat tax)...but people think that the percentage should be progressive so that they are paying far more than they should ever pay?

I don't get it guys. I just wasn't raised that way I guess. I see the world a bit differently than y'all do. And no, I'm not attacking anybody. I'm just saying that in my world view....EVERYBODY would contribute equally to society. And yes...we would all help the people who needed a "safety net".

The govt. is just simply out of control with spending in my opinion.

And the arguments in favor or our progressive tax rates are just plain out nuts to me.

Can you imagine, for instance, a strip club where one of the girls hustles harder and is just plain out better than the other girls...so she makes more tips. But at the end of the night the club would punish her by forcing her to give more money on her payout?
Bitches would revolt in the strip clubs! LOL

[GrantMercury]

Originally Posted by AsianDivaGirlsWebDude

What needs to occur is a lessening of the loopholes which undermine a fair progressive tax system.

ADG

Right.