Shouldn't we all be equal? - Page 2 - GoFuckYourself.com

Robbie · 09-04-2012, 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GrantMercury

Right.

But none of the people in that little cartoon actually pay the tax rate they are shown with.

That's the part of this whole class warfare argument that is never brought up.

Back when I was making $50,000 a year I NEVER actually paid the assigned tax rate I was supposed to pay. I took every deduction I could and squeezed out every last write off I could.

What's needed is a chart that shows what people REALLY pay. All those people in lower incomes do NOT actually pay their tax rate either.

This whole argument is such a joke.
Fact is people who actually make real money pay almost all the taxes in this country. Yet they don't get any more "services" from the govt. than anybody else. They just pay more.

I pay more money in taxes...more than most of you. And I can flat out tell you that I don't get anything more than any of you do (talking infrastructure...because I have NEVER gotten any kind of "assistance" from the govt. EVER)

BlackCrayon · 09-05-2012, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

But none of the people in that little cartoon actually pay the tax rate they are shown with.

That's the part of this whole class warfare argument that is never brought up.

Back when I was making $50,000 a year I NEVER actually paid the assigned tax rate I was supposed to pay. I took every deduction I could and squeezed out every last write off I could.

What's needed is a chart that shows what people REALLY pay. All those people in lower incomes do NOT actually pay their tax rate either.

This whole argument is such a joke.
Fact is people who actually make real money pay almost all the taxes in this country. Yet they don't get any more "services" from the govt. than anybody else. They just pay more.

I pay more money in taxes...more than most of you. And I can flat out tell you that I don't get anything more than any of you do (talking infrastructure...because I have NEVER gotten any kind of "assistance" from the govt. EVER)

beside the doctor, none of the professions used in the example can make deductions like a business can. you can't compare running a business where you can deduct a % of your office, utilities, etc to someone who makes a salary. they get none of that.

spazlabz · 09-05-2012, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sperbonzo

Or just use sales tax. Then as rich people spend huge amounts, they will pay huge amounts, poor people don't buy as much, so they don't pay as much.

.

OMFG!!!

can it be?

I agree with you

everyone hide!

Robbie · 09-05-2012, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackCrayon

beside the doctor, none of the professions used in the example can make deductions like a business can. you can't compare running a business where you can deduct a % of your office, utilities, etc to someone who makes a salary. they get none of that.

Bullshit. You have mortgage interest deduction. Deductions for your kids. Give stuff to goodwill and you can deduct that. If you refinance your home you can take a deduction on any points you pay to refinance. Health insurance premiums can be deducted. Teachers can take up to a $250 deduction for materials they purchased during the year. Go back to school and you can get a $4,000 deduction. You can get deductions for adding energy saving windows and doors to your house.
Fees you pay your accountant to prepare your taxes are deductible. The fees you pay to a broker for your retirement plan are deductible. The mileage you put on your car driving to see the financial adviser handling your 401 or IRA fund is deductible.

People do it all the time. NOBODY pays the exact rate that is listed on those charts. The cheapest tax software on the market will instantly lower that for you by showing you deductions you can take.

There's a reason people who are employees get "tax refund" checks at the end of the year. (something I, of course have never seen because I've always worked for myself).

Robbie · 09-05-2012, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackCrayon

beside the doctor, none of the professions used in the example can make deductions like a business can. you can't compare running a business where you can deduct a % of your office, utilities, etc to someone who makes a salary. they get none of that.

Also, keep in mind...that those people don't have to SPEND that money in the first place or take the risks associated with running a business.

GrantMercury · 09-06-2012, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

But none of the people in that little cartoon actually pay the tax rate they are shown with.

That's the part of this whole class warfare argument that is never brought up.

Back when I was making $50,000 a year I NEVER actually paid the assigned tax rate I was supposed to pay. I took every deduction I could and squeezed out every last write off I could.

What's needed is a chart that shows what people REALLY pay. All those people in lower incomes do NOT actually pay their tax rate either.

This whole argument is such a joke.
Fact is people who actually make real money pay almost all the taxes in this country. Yet they don't get any more "services" from the govt. than anybody else. They just pay more.

I pay more money in taxes...more than most of you. And I can flat out tell you that I don't get anything more than any of you do (talking infrastructure...because I have NEVER gotten any kind of "assistance" from the govt. EVER)

Those lucky poor people and their low taxes.

Careful, you'll wear out that back-patting arm.

Did you go to public school? Did your employees? Does your business utilize the government-created internet? Do you have a corporation or LLC that shields you from personal liability? Have you ever litigated in a taxpayer-funded court of law? Is your money in a bank protected by the FDIC?

I don't know what your business is. I don't care. You didn't become a success without some help along the way. Nobody does. We are all a part of a society. Get over yourself.

Anytime you want to give all your money away, you too, can live the good life that poor people now enjoy with their low taxes.

Being poor sucks. You won't find a poor person that wouldn't rather have money - even if it meant higher taxes.

We've got 311,592,000 people in America. Not all of them can be rich. If you're hanging on to that fantasy, it's long past time to give it up.

Quote:

Americans enjoy less economic mobility than their peers in Canada and much of Western Europe. The mobility gap has been widely discussed in academic circles, but a sour season of mass unemployment and street protests has moved the discussion toward center stage.

Former Senator Rick Santorum of Pennsylvania, a Republican candidate for president, warned this fall that movement ?up into the middle income is actually greater, the mobility in Europe, than it is in America.? National Review, a conservative thought leader, wrote that ?most Western European and English-speaking nations have higher rates of mobility.? Even Representative Paul D. Ryan, a Wisconsin Republican who argues that overall mobility remains high, recently wrote that ?mobility from the very bottom up? is ?where the United States lags behind.?

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/05/us...s.html?_r=1&hp

So it's pretty gross to hear rich people complain about taxes. Who should pay the bulk of the taxes? The poor who are struggling to get out of poverty?

Barry-xlovecam · 09-06-2012, 04:43 PM

Hypothetically, if I had personal net income (before tax sheltering) of $3 million a year and my total taxes were $1.05 million (35% current to marginal bracket) I would have 1.95 million left for me -- alligator tears -- tough to live on $1.95 Million a year.

My accountants could tax differ income, offshore profit centers, and create capital gains with sheltered real estate investment income ( all legally) now I pay 13% like Shit Robme. (At least I would be smart enough not to be so arrogant as to run for the highest public office in the land having made a career of being a shit-heel).

I become one of the ''job creators'' (for Lawyers and Accountants)? My wealth then trickles down and benefits society ... Bullshit! More like pisses on society ....

People like Warren Buffet, Bill Gates and other super rich don't complain about taxes that is because they know how good they have it.

Most people that are really wealthy become philanthropists in their waning years as they have so much they can't spend it all on themselves anyway while the pretenders to the throne bitch to their dying breath.

Greed is not good and you are remembered by your deeds.

Robbie · 09-06-2012, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GrantMercury

Did you go to public school? Did your employees? Does your business utilize the government-created internet? Do you have a corporation or LLC that shields you from personal liability? Have you ever litigated in a taxpayer-funded court of law? Is your money in a bank protected by the FDIC?

I don't know what your business is. I don't care. Y

Not that STUPID ass argument again.

Look man...public schools are paid for in LOCAL PROPERTY TAXES. Nothing to do with Federal income tax. Once you grow up and own your own home you'll discover that.

The internet? Not that again...that was created for the military. PRIVATE businesses turned it into something for the entire world to use.

What the fuck does paying federal income tax have to do with my LLC and personal liability?

The FEDERAL income tax does NOT pay for my local court of law. Local taxes do.

You are one ignorant and uninformed person. Which puts you in the majority.

No, I'm not calling you "stupid". You obviously are not. But you are definitely ignorant and uninformed.

Finally...you said: "I don't know what your business is"
Really?
Hint: I'm in the porn industry. DUH!
This forum is SUPPOSED to be for people in the adult porn industry. Maybe you are in the wrong place if you don't know what people on here do for a living.

mineistaken · 09-06-2012, 05:31 PM

successful people must pay losers' bills. Just look:
if you work hard and earn a lot you are being punished and made to pay for some lazy bastard who is doing nothing and gets rewarded for doing nothing.

Robbie · 09-06-2012, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barry-xlovecam

[INDENT]Hypothetically, if I had personal net income (before tax sheltering) of $3 million a year and my total taxes were $1.05 million (35% current to marginal bracket) I would have 1.95 million left for me -- alligator tears -- tough to live on $1.95 Million a year.

I don't think it would be a matter of whether you had a couple of million dollars left or not.
Point is...it's YOUR money. Not the govt.

You earned it. And trust me my friend...if you had to write a 1 million dollar check to the federal govt. for them to waste and funnel back to their buddies in their home states and fund more wars and military...you would NOT be happy about it.

If you are like any normal person, you want what is yours. And you want to give it to your children and enjoy the fruits of your labor.

Not saying we shouldn't pay any taxes. I'm just saying that you going on about how rich people already "have enough" is pure class warfare at it's worst.

It's THEIR money. Let them live their lives without being forced to give even more of it to CROOKED politicians.

What the fuck has happened to people's minds? Since when did everybody start thinking that the Federal govt. is all rainbows and fucking unicorns and so nice and benevolent?

Don't ANY of you watch the news? The majority of our tax money goes to killing people all over the world and congressmen funneling it back to their henchmen in their home states. A very SMALL bit goes to actually helping the poor.
Wake the fuck up!

Career politicians do NOT have your best interest at heart.

Barry-xlovecam · 09-06-2012, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GrantMercury

[D]id you go to public school? Did your employees? Does your business utilize the government-created internet? Do you have a corporation or LLC that shields you from personal liability? Have you ever litigated in a taxpayer-funded court of law? Is your money in a bank protected by the FDIC? ...

[D]id you go to public school?
Yes and my parents paid property taxes to support the schools.

Does your business utilize the government-created internet?
I paid tax money that the government used to innovate the internet but would agree that the money was well spent in disruptive and innovative basic research (a beneficial use of taxpayer dollars)

Do you have a corporation or LLC that shields you from personal liability?
Yes, but personal liability is not the primary reason that I am incorporated -- that is naive.

Have you ever litigated in a taxpayer-funded court of law?
Yes, but what does that have to do with the price of potato chips in Egypt? We live in a nation of laws, our tax dollars support the Courts and they are open to the indigent of society for free (court documents are allowed to be filed free In forma pauperis)

Is your money in a bank protected by the FDIC?
Yes, but every bank pays the FDIC a premium for this insurance and passes the cost to the bank's customers in the forms of; fees, less interest paid on deposits, and more interest paid on its lending. FDIC insurance is not a free ride paid buy the government and a deficit results in the premium rates charged to the individual banks to rise.

FYI;
Federal and state unemployment taxes are adjusted according to actual outflows also.
Social Security disability and retirement is taxpayer earned and funded.
Medicare is an earned benefit of Social Security.

All of us benefit from some government spending directly and that is one of the legitimate purposes of government. But whether I pay more for benefits like the basic research in developing the internet as example we both get the same opportunity to profit from it or use it -- some can develop a business from it and others will use it for entertainment and their other needs (each according to their ability and effort). We all benefit, we all have an equal opportunity to use it. How we use it is up to us -- in most countries we can direct our own destiny, we are not oppressed surfs in the Middle Ages.

See Robbie: I can agree with you when you are right

tony286 · 09-06-2012, 06:14 PM

Actually federal funds do go to state education. You are mistaken. Google is your friend

davethedope · 09-06-2012, 06:17 PM

Barry-xlovecam · 09-06-2012, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

Not saying we shouldn't pay any taxes. I'm just saying that you going on about how rich people already "have enough" is pure class warfare at it's worst.

It's THEIR money. Let them live their lives without being forced to give even more of it to CROOKED politicians.

I guess I must be nuts -- I don't feel that I am deprived of my wealth after paying my taxes.

When I see men (getting Federal Prevailing or Union Wages) working on federally funded road repair and improvement projects I do not curse my Congressman for feeding his cronies.

I happen to agree with some of our military spending but some is not necessary IMHO with my limited information sources.

The government in America is not that oppressive -- move to Eastern Europe if you don't believe me. Even better, move to Belarus or North Korea.

I bring foreign earnings into this country, supporting the local economy (which sucks ATM), and pay taxes in America. I don't feel that my money is confiscated. I live within my means and don't feel the need to impress anyone. I have never been greedy by nature, people may ponder that but I have no problem with it -- life is good and will get better.

I haven't watched television news in 10 years -- it's mind garbage. I do read the news on the internet from all sources, recognising extremist viewpoints for what they are. Maybe I am more open mined not being fed bullshit by the ''talking heads.''

And you are right Tony, there is federal funding for education in supplement to our property taxes -- I don't mind that expenditure of my tax dollars when it is a responsible expenditure -- better than spent building fighter planes and tanks anyway. However, I could bitch why my tax dollars go to lesser school districts that mine -- those children of color don't deserve the chance an education might give. But that would be bigoted wouldn't it? I went to an integrated public school and I am glad the school got Federal Funding.

ColBigBalls · 09-06-2012, 06:47 PM

I just spit beer out my nose lol

Best troll thread in a long time.

Robbie · 09-06-2012, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tony286

Actually federal funds do go to state education. You are mistaken. Google is your friend

Yeah, 10%. http://febp.newamerica.net/backgroun...school-finance

Robbie · 09-06-2012, 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barry-xlovecam

I guess I must be nuts -- I don't feel that I am deprived of my wealth after paying my taxes.

Nobody is talking about you being "deprived of your wealth".

My point is...the U.S. govt. is spending 7 MILLION DOLLARS per MINUTE. That is insane.

Way too much on the military. We have a colossus military, but there is no real war we are fighting. And there is no enemy for all those ships and planes and nuclear missiles and military bases.

If my money were being spent to build roads (which it isn't...state and local taxes AND the national gasoline tax does) or actually fund the local schools (it's not) or help the poor (tiny sliver of it)...then that would be one thing.

But the reality is they are spending 7 million dollars a minute on foreign aid, military spending, congressmen taking trips and having a huge staff and free health care for life, and a monstrosity of bureaucracy as well as corruption and funneling money back to their cronies.

The Federal budget this year (2012) is 2.252 TRILLION dollars! (of which 1.1 trillion is DEFICIT spending).

Think about that. A billion dollars is a thousand million. A trillion is a thousand billion dollars.

There were 42 million total people in poverty in 2010. If you broke that down into families and just assumed that there are 3 people per family on average...that would be 14 million families.
So if you took 2 trillion dollars of this years budget you could just straight out give 2 million families a million dollars each.
Do that for 7 years and you just wiped out poverty and created 14 million Millionaire households.

Sounds crazy...but guess what? Since 1965 when Johnson launched the "War On Poverty" we have spend over 10 TRILLION dollars.

And poverty has went up anyway. Kinda like Nixon's "War On Drugs". lol

My point is that the govt. takes your money and wastes it. They don't get it to the poor people who really need it. First it goes to pay bureaucrats salaries and offices and expenses...then a lot of it gets skimmed through corruption.

I would rather pay just enough taxes for our govt. to just be able to do what it has to do. No more, no less. If our country has decided to help the poor...then let's really do it and not spend one dime more than is needed.

7 million dollars a minute they are spending. Don't you think that's way out of line?

jimmy-3-way · 09-06-2012, 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

I think the point he is making is...Yes. The guy who is smarter and faster than you shouldn't be penalized for just kicking more ass in life. UNLESS he gets millions of dollars back in services from the federal govt.

Mitt Romney swiped a $10-15million bailout for Bain from the US Treasury.

Sounds like he got a little more than I ever will.

Robbie · 09-06-2012, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimmy-3-way

Mitt Romney swiped a $10-15million bailout for Bain from the US Treasury.

Sounds like he got a little more than I ever will.

Wrong;

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...Sh7W_blog.html

DTK · 09-07-2012, 12:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keysync

Last I heard most of the cities in your Wonderland of a west coast were going bankrupt.

exaggerate much?

_Richard_ · 09-07-2012, 12:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

Wrong;

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...Sh7W_blog.html

perhaps, friend, you should try reading that story from a less biased source

like, HOW romney 'convinced' the government

GrantMercury · 09-07-2012, 01:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mineistaken

successful people must pay losers' bills. Just look:
if you work hard and earn a lot you are being punished and made to pay for some lazy bastard who is doing nothing and gets rewarded for doing nothing.

Right. Paris Hilton works like a dog. It ain't easy to party 24/7

Rochard · 09-07-2012, 01:20 AM

But we are not all equal.

Some of us work harder than others, and are properly rewarded. Right now I'm on vacation and I just spent the past two hours working. I make good money and I don't pay jack fucking shit in taxes.

Why should someone working eighty hours a week making french fries pay more in taxes than me?

At some point in time you need to apply common sense here. Someone who makes $40k a year shouldn't be paying more in taxes than someone making $500k.

scarlettcontent · 09-07-2012, 01:23 AM

more tax for the rich

SmutHammer · 09-07-2012, 01:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

But we are not all equal.

Some of us work harder than others, and are properly rewarded. Right now I'm on vacation and I just spent the past two hours working. I make good money and I don't pay jack fucking shit in taxes.

Why should someone working eighty hours a week making french fries pay more in taxes than me?

At some point in time you need to apply common sense here. Someone who makes $40k a year shouldn't be paying more in taxes than someone making $500k.

No body ever said that some one making less money should pay more taxes...

jimmy-3-way · 09-07-2012, 03:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

Wrong;

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...Sh7W_blog.html

"After months of negotiations, the outstanding loan was reduced by $10 million, including forgone interest."

Did you read the article you linked by any chance?

Barry-xlovecam · 09-07-2012, 05:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

[I]f my money were being spent to build roads (which it isn't...state and local taxes AND the national gasoline tax does) or actually fund the local schools (it's not) or help the poor (tiny sliver of it)...then that would be one thing. ...

I was a building contractor for 13 years, specializing in stone masonry work, and won a lot of bids to apply stone masonry veneers to road bridges. Many of the bridges on state highways and even local roads are partially funded with Federal Revenue Sharing Funds -- I know this for fact as my subcontracts were subject to Davis-Bacon Act Federal prevailing wage requirements. All work you see done on Interstate Highways is Federally funded of course.

I guess our Congressman may be more successful in getting federal road construction dollars to his district possibly as they have been doing repairs to the Interstate here that leads top the Canadian border and is a main import-export route -- and that may be the justification. BTW, we are a donor state supporting a lot of poorer states and that might have to do with some of the funds received.

You might note that Nevada is a net recipient state according to some data for federally funded road work projects (2009) ... http://www.heritage.org/research/rep...e-states#_edn1

Too funny Heritage is a right wing 'think tank'

Quote:

''Founded in 1973, The Heritage Foundation is a research and educational institution?a think tank?whose mission is to formulate and promote conservative public policies based on the principles of free enterprise, limited government, individual freedom, traditional American values, and a strong national defense. ''

roly · 09-07-2012, 05:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed Hammer

Yes, Why should it be different? the guy paying more isn't even using government services...

people who earn more can afford to pay more. its called society and if you don't want to be a part of it and contribute you can move to a different country, simple. but if taxes are kept at a reasonable rate people don't move because they want to enjoy those things in life that taxes pay for.

Rochard · 09-07-2012, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed Hammer

No body ever said that some one making less money should pay more taxes...

Your not paying attention are you?

Rochard · 09-07-2012, 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

Bullshit. You have mortgage interest deduction. Deductions for your kids. Give stuff to goodwill and you can deduct that. If you refinance your home you can take a deduction on any points you pay to refinance. Health insurance premiums can be deducted. Teachers can take up to a $250 deduction for materials they purchased during the year. Go back to school and you can get a $4,000 deduction. You can get deductions for adding energy saving windows and doors to your house.
Fees you pay your accountant to prepare your taxes are deductible. The fees you pay to a broker for your retirement plan are deductible. The mileage you put on your car driving to see the financial adviser handling your 401 or IRA fund is deductible.

People do it all the time. NOBODY pays the exact rate that is listed on those charts. The cheapest tax software on the market will instantly lower that for you by showing you deductions you can take.

There's a reason people who are employees get "tax refund" checks at the end of the year. (something I, of course have never seen because I've always worked for myself).

Again, I think your wrong. You seem to think everyone takes deductions but I think most people have no idea what deductions they can take, and at the same time they are limited as to what deductions they can take. If you are a twenty year old cashier renting an apartment with no kids, your pretty much screwed while you and I are writing off more than they make.

Trend · 09-07-2012, 10:20 AM

I support the FairTax

The FairTax is a national sales tax that treats every person equally and allows American businesses to thrive, while generating the same tax revenue as the current three-million-word-plus word tax code. Under the FairTax, every person living in the United States pays a 23% national sales tax on purchases of new goods and services. This rate is equal to the lowest current income tax bracket (15%) combined with employee payroll taxes (7.65%), both of which will be eliminated.

Trend · 09-07-2012, 10:23 AM

On a sidenote, what makes me sick is this:

I could have paid my mortgage, all utilities, all groceries and my car payments with what I paid last year in taxes.

and I'm not "rich"

Bryan G · 09-07-2012, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed Hammer

Everyone is bitching about tax cuts for the rich...

We were all born in or live in America, Some of us more successful than others. Some were born into money because their parents/grandparents or whatever worked hard and were successful.

Wouldn't it be fair for everyone to pay the same amount of taxes to the government? fuck the % of money you make, Everyone should pay the exact same dollar amount, Then we would truly all be treated fair and equal

So a college kid working his way through school should pay a flat tax?? Same as someone who's making whatever a year?

Bryan G · 09-07-2012, 10:32 AM

Further more if a flat tax is implemented how do you think that will stimulate the economy? If person A is making 30k a year and person B making 200k a year both are paying a flat tax of say 10k. Just exactly how does person A go out and buy stuff like cars, houses, furniture etc?? When people don't spend the economy crashes.

Barry-xlovecam · 09-07-2012, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trend

I support the FairTax

The FairTax is a national sales tax that treats every person equally and allows American businesses to thrive, while generating the same tax revenue as the current three-million-word-plus word tax code. Under the FairTax, every person living in the United States pays a 23% national sales tax on purchases of new goods and services. This rate is equal to the lowest current income tax bracket (15%) combined with employee payroll taxes (7.65%), both of which will be eliminated.

Great, are corporations living persons living in the United States?

Who pays the costs of businessmen to collect the FairTax and remit it to the government?

And there is no income tax at all?

Tom_PM · 09-07-2012, 10:44 AM

Ok. Lets all pay the same flat dollar amount. I propose that the amount be 15 million US dollars per year. All in favor?

Barry-xlovecam · 09-07-2012, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PR_Tom

Ok. Lets all pay the same flat dollar amount. I propose that the amount be 15 million US dollars per year. All in favor?

The check is in the mail

Kevin Marx · 09-07-2012, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

But we are not all equal.

Some of us work harder than others, and are properly rewarded. Right now I'm on vacation and I just spent the past two hours working. I make good money and I don't pay jack fucking shit in taxes.

Why should someone working eighty hours a week making french fries pay more in taxes than me?

At some point in time you need to apply common sense here. Someone who makes $40k a year shouldn't be paying more in taxes than someone making $500k.

$$$ and % are different things. A larger percentage does not mean a larger amount.

Kevin Marx · 09-07-2012, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roly

people who earn more can afford to pay more. its called society and if you don't want to be a part of it and contribute you can move to a different country, simple. but if taxes are kept at a reasonable rate people don't move because they want to enjoy those things in life that taxes pay for.

People who earn more can afford to pay more? How about.... People who earn more can afford to have more taken from them?

For that matter.... my local grocery store has a shitload on it's shelves. It can afford if some of it is just taken or handed out to people for free. Right?

If taxes are kept at a reasonable rate people don't move because they want to enjoy those things in life taxes pay for? I was with you right up to the "taxes pay for" part.

Kevin Marx · 09-07-2012, 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

Again, I think your wrong. You seem to think everyone takes deductions but I think most people have no idea what deductions they can take, and at the same time they are limited as to what deductions they can take. If you are a twenty year old cashier renting an apartment with no kids, your pretty much screwed while you and I are writing off more than they make.

I was that 20 year old kid once and felt the same I do now.

Why should a 20 year old be treated the same as the 50 year old btw? The 50 year old has more experience, more time in life to have built up what they have desired.

Get rid of deductions, make it straight across the board. I don't give a rats ass if you are a person or business, treat them all equally. Businesses reap massive benefits right now in comparison to individuals..... another discussion in and of itself entirely.

_Richard_ · 09-07-2012, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimmy-3-way

"After months of negotiations, the outstanding loan was reduced by $10 million, including forgone interest."

Did you read the article you linked by any chance?

did you read any other article? he got that loan reduced by threatening ot take all the liquid cash from the loan, and bonus it to all the partners

with that threat, the government decided to allow the reduction in order to get any money back at all

can you imagine if we, as individuals, had a similar situation?

Robbie · 09-07-2012, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barry-xlovecam

Great, are corporations living persons living in the United States?

Who pays the costs of businessmen to collect the FairTax and remit it to the government?

And there is no income tax at all?

He said it's a SALES tax. So yes..everything a corporation buys would be taxed at that rate. They would pay MORE in taxes than they currently do (they write off all that stuff currently...now they would be taxed on it)

roly · 09-07-2012, 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin Marx

People who earn more can afford to pay more? How about.... People who earn more can afford to have more taken from them?

its the same thing

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin Marx

For that matter.... my local grocery store has a shitload on it's shelves. It can afford if some of it is just taken or handed out to people for free. Right?

no, they already pay taxes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin Marx

If taxes are kept at a reasonable rate people don't move because they want to enjoy those things in life taxes pay for? I was with you right up to the "taxes pay for" part.

well no doubt part of the reason you live where you live is it has decent roads, your kids can go to good schools, you can sleep safely in your house because of a police presence.... etc etc its got to be paid for somehow, and taxation is the means. if you don't like it go and live in a 3rd world shithole where no one pays taxes.

Tom_PM · 09-07-2012, 12:55 PM

I'd say it's fairly accurate to say the the less a person makes the less they can afford to have taken out. After all, if you have $100 and I have $10 and the flat tax is $9 I'm pretty much wiped out while you are pretty much fine.

So obviously it doesn't need to be said really.. a percentage is what a flat tax is about, not a dollar amount.

And a clearly perverted picture is the $100 person paying 15% while the $10 person pays 25%. Right? Right. So very simple.

Barry-xlovecam · 09-07-2012, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

He said it's a SALES tax. So yes..everything a corporation buys would be taxed at that rate. They would pay MORE in taxes than they currently do (they write off all that stuff currently...now they would be taxed on it)

Read it again he said a "every living person in the United States" a corporation is a "legal person " there is a difference."

Quote:

Question: Will corporations get a windfall with the abolition of the corporate tax?

Answer: Corporations are legal fictions that have not, do not, and never will bear the burden of taxation. Only people pay taxes. Corporations pass on their tax burden in the form of higher prices to consumers, lower wages to workers, and/or lower returns to investors. The idea that taxing a corporation reduces taxes on, say the working poor, is a cruel hoax. A corporate tax only makes what the working poor buy more expensive, costs them jobs, lowers their lifestyle, or delays their retirement. Under the FairTax plan, money retained in the business and reinvested to create jobs, build factories, or develop new technologies, pays no tax. This is the most honest, fair, productive tax system possible. Free market competition will do the rest
http://www.fairtaxplan.org/faq_item.php?id=23

This should make the Koch Brothers blush LMAO

What a tax loophole LOL

https://www.google.com/search?q=fair...corporation%22

Robbie · 09-07-2012, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barry-xlovecam

Read it again he said a "every living person in the United States" a corporation is a "legal person " there is a difference."

I thought we were discussing the idea of a national sales tax? That's what you originally were answering about when I answered you.

And in that scenario...everything would have a national sales tax. Doesn't matter if you, me, my dog, or a corporation buys something..it will be taxes at the suggested 23% national sales tax.

So a big corporation that buys a hundred million dollars worth of supplies..they currently write that off their taxes.
But with the sales tax...they would pay $23 million dollars in sales tax.

Barry-xlovecam · 09-07-2012, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trend

I support the FairTax

The FairTax is a national sales tax that treats every person equally and allows American businesses to thrive, while generating the same tax revenue as the current three-million-word-plus word tax code. Under the FairTax, every person living in the United States pays a 23% national sales tax on purchases of new goods and services. This rate is equal to the lowest current income tax bracket (15%) combined with employee payroll taxes (7.65%), both of which will be eliminated.

Wrong -- the FairTax

Fair to whom. Nowhere does it say the FairTax applies to legal persons.

"Answer: Corporations are legal fictions that have not, do not, and never will bear the burden of taxation. Only people pay taxes."

What are these people smoking?

Kevin Marx · 09-07-2012, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roly

its the same thing

no, they already pay taxes.

well no doubt part of the reason you live where you live is it has decent roads, your kids can go to good schools, you can sleep safely in your house because of a police presence.... etc etc its got to be paid for somehow, and taxation is the means. if you don't like it go and live in a 3rd world shithole where no one pays taxes.

1- Nope, not the same thing, the statement "they can afford to pay more" gives a supposition that they are willingly or voluntarily doing so. I prefer to pay as little taxes as possible, irregardless of the amount I have earned over the years. Having it taken from you is forceful and involuntary by nature. I'd much rather give my money to charity that intends to use it in distinct manners than have the government forcefully take it from me and wastefully spend it... and in fact take more from the higher dollars I have earned just because they were above a certain threshhold. How is the first dollar of the year I spend on a gallon of milk that different from the dollar earned at the 110k level spent on milk? Is it because I have more dollars available to spend on milk that I therefore need to give it to the government to distribute it on my behalf for the betterment of society? Sounds reasonable right up until you start discussing how the monies are being spent by the govt and by many of the people receiving the assistance.

2- was just a metaphor for theft... paying taxes had nothing to do with it

3- Yes, you are correct. Paid for by taxes. But who's taxes? If I'm effectively paying 20% and my neighbor is only paying 7% due to our earnings, who's actually paying? What if my effective bill is 1million but his is only 17k? In those instances we are not paying the same and therefore your question is... who pays for it? Overwhelmingly, the higher earners and higher tax payers are. Even under a flat tax scenario they would be.

Yes, it's got to be paid for somehow. It is being paid for. It's overwhelmingly paid for by (borrowing mostly, but repayments being made by) the higher earners and on the whole they use less of the services (although road usage and post office usage and military usage is pretty much equal for everyone; just not equally paid for by everyone).

DamageX · 09-07-2012, 01:52 PM

Equality is a myth.

Kevin Marx · 09-07-2012, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyClips

lol at everyone arguing yet ANOTHER useless point

There shouldn't be taxation because taxation is theft

Unequal taxation is theft.

Taxation is merely society agreeing to absorb societal costs among the collective to help benefit the collective.

Suggestions on how to make things work otherwise?

09-06-2012, 04:43 PM	#57
Barry-xlovecam It's 42 Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Global Posts: 18,083	Hypothetically, if I had personal net income (before tax sheltering) of $3 million a year and my total taxes were $1.05 million (35% current to marginal bracket) I would have 1.95 million left for me -- alligator tears -- tough to live on $1.95 Million a year. My accountants could tax differ income, offshore profit centers, and create capital gains with sheltered real estate investment income ( all legally) now I pay 13% like Shit Robme. (At least I would be smart enough not to be so arrogant as to run for the highest public office in the land having made a career of being a shit-heel). I become one of the ''job creators'' (for Lawyers and Accountants)? My wealth then trickles down and benefits society ... Bullshit! More like pisses on society .... People like Warren Buffet, Bill Gates and other super rich don't complain about taxes that is because they know how good they have it. Most people that are really wealthy become philanthropists in their waning years as they have so much they can't spend it all on themselves anyway while the pretenders to the throne bitch to their dying breath. Greed is not good and you are remembered by your deeds.

09-07-2012, 01:20 AM	#73
Rochard Jägermeister Test Pilot Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: NORCAL Posts: 73,836	But we are not all equal. Some of us work harder than others, and are properly rewarded. Right now I'm on vacation and I just spent the past two hours working. I make good money and I don't pay jack fucking shit in taxes. Why should someone working eighty hours a week making french fries pay more in taxes than me? At some point in time you need to apply common sense here. Someone who makes $40k a year shouldn't be paying more in taxes than someone making $500k. __________________ “The choice is no longer between right or left. The choice is between normal and crazy.” - Sarah Huckabee Sanders YNOT MAIL \| THE BEST ADULT MAILING SOLUTION

09-07-2012, 01:23 AM	#74
scarlettcontent www.scarlettcontent.net Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Pleiades Posts: 6,031	more tax for the rich __________________ Scarlett Content - Adult Content Provider - High Quality Adult Stock Content for your Websites, Mobile Media and Print. Over 3 Million Images (14,000 photo sets) over 5000 Videos - Many Niches, US-2257, Awesome Prices. Over 40 years in the adult industry. [email protected] Follow us on twitter.

09-07-2012, 10:32 AM	#84
Bryan G Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Toronto Posts: 8,338	Further more if a flat tax is implemented how do you think that will stimulate the economy? If person A is making 30k a year and person B making 200k a year both are paying a flat tax of say 10k. Just exactly how does person A go out and buy stuff like cars, houses, furniture etc?? When people don't spend the economy crashes. __________________ Bryan skype: bryan.glass3 \| ICQ 302999591

09-07-2012, 10:44 AM	#86
Tom_PM Porn Meister Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 16,443	Ok. Lets all pay the same flat dollar amount. I propose that the amount be 15 million US dollars per year. All in favor? __________________ 43-922-863 Shut up and play your guitar.

09-06-2012, 05:31 PM	#59
mineistaken See signature :) Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: ICQ 363 097 773 Posts: 29,656	successful people must pay losers' bills. Just look: if you work hard and earn a lot you are being punished and made to pay for some lazy bastard who is doing nothing and gets rewarded for doing nothing.

09-06-2012, 06:14 PM	#62
tony286 lurker Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: atlanta Posts: 57,021	Actually federal funds do go to state education. You are mistaken. Google is your friend

09-06-2012, 06:17 PM	#63
davethedope Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 532

09-06-2012, 06:47 PM	#65
ColBigBalls Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 1,733	I just spit beer out my nose lol Best troll thread in a long time.

09-07-2012, 10:20 AM	#81
Trend Confirmed User Join Date: May 2008 Location: Mexico and Midwest Posts: 612	I support the FairTax The FairTax is a national sales tax that treats every person equally and allows American businesses to thrive, while generating the same tax revenue as the current three-million-word-plus word tax code. Under the FairTax, every person living in the United States pays a 23% national sales tax on purchases of new goods and services. This rate is equal to the lowest current income tax bracket (15%) combined with employee payroll taxes (7.65%), both of which will be eliminated.

09-07-2012, 10:23 AM	#82
Trend Confirmed User Join Date: May 2008 Location: Mexico and Midwest Posts: 612	On a sidenote, what makes me sick is this: I could have paid my mortgage, all utilities, all groceries and my car payments with what I paid last year in taxes. and I'm not "rich"

09-07-2012, 12:55 PM	#94
Tom_PM Porn Meister Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 16,443	I'd say it's fairly accurate to say the the less a person makes the less they can afford to have taken out. After all, if you have $100 and I have $10 and the flat tax is $9 I'm pretty much wiped out while you are pretty much fine. So obviously it doesn't need to be said really.. a percentage is what a flat tax is about, not a dollar amount. And a clearly perverted picture is the $100 person paying 15% while the $10 person pays 25%. Right? Right. So very simple. __________________ 43-922-863 Shut up and play your guitar.

09-07-2012, 01:52 PM	#99
DamageX Marketing & Strategy Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Former nomad Posts: 14,293	Equality is a myth. __________________ Whitehat is for chumps If you don't do it, somebody else will - true story!