Antonio

Here's another link that shows you the HDI and the inequality-adjusted HDI:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Development_Index

Scroll down to Inequality-adjusted HDI and you will see just how "poor" Bulgaria makes it to the top 36 and Russia is nowhere to be found.

I don't have any illusions as to how Bulgaria compares to the rest of the EU, but you clearly refuse to see where Russia is. And BTW, I do have a degree in Economics, can't say that I remember all that much, but at least I remember the basics.

This is getting weird ;)


.

just a punk

Nope at all. I just had a feeling you don't live in Bulgaria right now.

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Antonio

Moved back from South Africa about eight years ago.

Sid70

Can't understand shit, cap.

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just a punk

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Sid70

Please, could you post 5 screenshots of Wikipedia in each thread?

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just a punk

Sure thing. Can I post videos too? Pleeeeeeease



Какая страна, такая и армия

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CAHEK

Watch As Ukraine Helicopter With 14 Troops On Board Is Shot Down

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Sid70

No, you're doing fine with GIFs already, videos is for pussies.

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klinton

such thinking is not valid, as for example: Luanda in Angola is expensive, Port au Prince in Haiti is expensive if you want to have running water, electricity and decent(normal) food..and many more examples to come ;-)
I'm not comparing Russia to these countries, simple proving that such logic doesnt work :-)

femdomdestiny

Luanda, Angola or Haiti are not places where big companies want to invest or countries that can influence global changes depending on their choices. Prices there are coming from lack of basic things like infrastructure, while in Moscow, it is just about demand and offer.

Money used to buy properties and land in Europe is coming from Russia (from London to Montenegro), not from Angola or Haiti.

We all know reaction from big companies (for example Siemens) after "sanctions" for Russia and EU reaction after gas agreement with Chinese.

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klinton

it doesnt change the fact that they are ridiculously expensive shitholes, and yes, in Angola and, lets say Nigeria, many western companies invest, they send expats to work in there, and their goverments just steal from average citizens
so the logic of thinking = if city is expensive, country must to be rich like its citizens - it is simply not valid and it doesnt work

femdomdestiny

His logic is much better then comparing countries you used to prove your point. Countries you used as example are expensive form different reasons ,and not because of market and services. (these are undeveloped countries with uneducated population and probably not market based economies)

Of course companies are investing everywhere, they will always do that even on Mars or swamp if there is profit, but comparing Nigeria with Russia is completely wrong. Even with 168 millions of people Nigeria (that lots of oil ) have GDP of 262 billion while Russia have: $2.118 trillion with 20 millions people less.

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Sid70

[QUOTE=femdomdestiny;20104325]Luanda, Angola or Haiti are not places where big companies want to invest or countries that can influence global changes depending on their choices. Prices there are coming from lack of basic things like infrastructure, while in Moscow, it is just about demand and offer.

Money used to buy properties and land in Europe is coming from Russia (from London to Montenegro), not from Angola or Haiti.
/QUOTE]

Wrong.

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femdomdestiny

what is this about? they dropped guns and moved to anti nazi side, or what? have they been defeated or did this by their own will?

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klinton

I'm sorry, but I prefer Berlin than Moscow..Cheaper, less smog, less traffic, once again - cheaper, more bicycles, happy not agressive people, way better customer service, avergae citizen = richer than average Russian, 80 milions in country (2 times less than in Russia), yet GDP few times bigger...how they do that ? :-)

femdomdestiny

Masrhall plan for a start? Lack of population after WW2 that was so bad that Germany started to import workforce from around the globe. US support and supervision for decades and , of course, traditional German discipline. ( don't forget that they didn't have expenses for army for decades because of US di that for them so no costs of maintaining or investing in development)

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klinton

it was rhetorical question... the main point is = the fact that something (or some city) is expensive doesnt mean that it should be and it doesnt mean that being expensive makes it really valuable :-)

just a punk

Nope. These are soldiers of so-called regular Ukrainian "army". They dropped their weapon and surrendered to their own moms, dads and "ruskie terrorists". No j/k.

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femdomdestiny

I've added one more row of text about army expenses while you were typing.

Personally, I don't agree. If economy is market based and regions are geographically close (europe and european part of Russia) it says a lot,just like Cyber SEO used as argument.

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just a punk

Almost correct except the "better customer service". Have you been to Moscow? Believe me, Berlin customer service sucks a big time. I've been to many place to compare and I know what I'm talking about.

P.S. Course an average Berlin citizen is richer than an average Russian one. But if we compare Berlin citizens vs Moscow ones, I wouldn't be that sure ;)

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klinton

if overpaying makes people rich, then it is like that.....

klinton

average German citizen vs. average Russian citizen, thats what I mean

femdomdestiny

there is no money that could pay me for listening German language around me, comparing to soft and nice Russian. It is a matter of person taste, of course

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crockett

Yes, it's a civil war at this point, but that's not the point I was making. Yes the Militia guys will keep on fighting and get supplies from Russia, but it's very clear Putin is trying to distance Russia at this point.

Putin is no longer posturing that he's going to roll right in and take over the area.. He's distanced himself and has even started to pull troops away from the boarder. Yes some will stay to make sure fighting doesn't cross the boarder, but he's no longer keeping 40k troops on alert ready to go.

The problem now becomes if it does turn into a full on civil war, it's on Russia's boarder and this means things can and likely will spill over into Russia. This means Russia becomes less stable and bad for Russia, which is the reason Putin is backing away publicly.

klinton

now, please answer me: what would US do if, lets say, Mexico got gover. (that was legally elected before) overthrowed during bloody riots, and new gov. that would be created from these riots would say: "we are going to have trade union with China/Russia now, we will favor companies from these countries, and we changed our course by 180 degrees, on political, economic and diplomatic front..."
also, this new Mexico's government would have some issues with any Yankees on their soil and they would be racist towards them

would US concentrate some troops near border, maybe would use some paramiliatary groups, some diversion, some spies or would just sit and watch ? :-)

just a punk

Who cares about this moron? Even the Ukrainian separatists are out of his control. The civilian war in the Ukraine has been started and not by Putin.

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just a punk

Not even a chance for that. Just trust me. If you don't, please wait. The time will tell who was right and who was wrong. As about the current situation in the Ukraine. I have predicted it in 2013 (I believe any sane person predicted it as well).

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just a punk

I don't feel for both sides: the Ukrainian NAZI army and the separatists. The only people I feel for are civilian Ukrainian citizens who's being killed because of this conflict. But once again, all the blood is on hands of the US and EU governments that have pushed and backed up the Maydan revolution.

Yes, Russia was wrong by annexing of Crimea (even if 90% of local citizens were supporting it), but at least I have to admit that Russia did it w/o blood. I can't imagine how many people would be killed in Crimea by now if Putin hadn't "stole" it from the Ukraine. A war in South-East is the best marker for even a complete idiot like these Americans who can't even locate the Ukraine on the World map:



And these guys are predefining to be experts on situation in the Ukraine? Don't make me laugh please...

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femdomdestiny

SO you think it would better to hand over Sevastopol base to NATO? they won't stop and force is the only one to stop them. Same applies to eastern ukraine.

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just a punk

I don't think so. I do respect the territorial integrity on the Ukraine. NATO is our enemy and we have to deal with it (fortunately Russia has enough power to resist). However it's not a reason to turn regular Ukrainians into our foes. That's my personal point.

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crockett

Mexico is in a sort of civil war of sorts right now, but rather being different groups of civilians that dislike the other it's the drug cartels fighting each other and the govt. Tens of thousands have been killed and it's gone on since 2006, yet the US has not invaded.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexican_Drug_War

femdomdestiny

No one will attack Russia in a way you can count on firepower and men. It is done through destabilization (or coordinated destabilization in multiple regions) and making problems in bordering regions. Proximity of enemy is very important. (logistics, support, and easy media coverage from close territories , since in Russia case they can't fly over country and play TV channels with suitable messages).

It lasts for year, and in previous decades NATO already came on borders, playing on card from asslickers from ex Varszaw pact states.

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just a punk

Are you playing a fool or what? A drug war is just a drug war. I suspect that USA also lost a comparable amount of citizens because of drug gang wars since 2006. Yes, right on your streets. But that's not a civilian war.

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femdomdestiny

Are you blind, infantile or maybe both? He told something completely different.

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just a punk

You will be surprised but all Western media channels are available in Russia (CNN, Fox, BBC, NBC, Deutsche Welle etc). Even EuroNews is being broadcasted here 24/7 with Russian translation for whose who don't understand English.

As about the destabilization. Perhaps NATO guys were thinking that the Ukrainian mess will destabilize Russia, but in fact they were wrong. The Putin's trust rating now is 78% which is an absolute record for him. He has never had it before and would never have it in future if there was no civilian war in the Ukraine. He had something around 50% in November 2013 and now 78 fuckin' percents (wow! just wow!) Who could imagine this a half of a year earlier?

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femdomdestiny

I am not talking about that, but about emitting special programs during operations for locals. Control in media coverage completely is one of the most important things. People are hungry for info in these moments. Once cable signals are disrupted during war , people will use classic antennas. Remember bombing of Television in Belgrade?

Yes, NATO did a favor to Putin. But long term, Putin won't live forever, and blood is there and from peaceful coexistence with Ukraine like before, now we have killing, devastation and blood that no one will forget and will be only worse. As I've mentioned above, processes like these are done for years, and planned long upfront.

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klinton

yeah I know what is going on Mexico right now. You may thank for that to brilliant US policy "war on drugs" and US loyal base of drugs consumers

yet, there still exist gov. in Mexico that is loyal to US gov. and its agencies (on many levels), have no will to change anything... note that there is no political civil war...just normal gangsters ;-)

klinton

why people just cant get along normally, always looking for enemies

MaDalton

i know i should not have opened this thread...

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crockett

He used Mexico as an example, I didn't pick it. I simply stated that there is already a significant amount of fighting going on south of our boarder and it does carry over into the US.

No it's not the same as civilians fighting civilians and I said that. I simply replied to a situation in which he choose as an example being Mexico which in fact has a war going on with in it's boarders and yes it does spill into the US, but again the US is not invading Mexico due to unrest.

You think they are just little drives bys? The Cartels have standing armies and are well armed, Mexico is in a pretty significant fight.

You going to watch these videos and tell me there is no war?

crockett

Yes this is true, but keep in mind most of the political figures with-in Mexico are corrupt and bought with cartel drug money. So even though the govt is aligned with the US, it's still problematic.

You could almost say the cartels are states with-in Mexico that have no actual boarders. They are as powerful as the govt, so it's the same as fighting a well armed militia, but rather than being political motivated they are motivated by profits.

just a punk

They can. Gorbachev was told that NATO won't do even a step towards Russia, when he allowed to break the Berlin's wall. And what do we have now?

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crockett

Lets be fair Russia has broken pretty much every agreement with NATO, so they are not innocent. Most recently they have broken the START treaty..by testing short range cruise missiles.

Russia always breaks these agreements when it suits their needs.

klinton

yop, that's how they do politics in there ;-)

klinton

like every country... I think that both Russians are fear-fuelled by RT and Americans by their own media, and, as always - somebody is/will be making good profit from it

so i dont know...cheers guys ;]

crockett

Yes, I think it's very silly to be honest. Russians and Americans are very close to the same in many ways but it just shows what govt propaganda can do to make people think the other is a enemy.

qwe

He didn't steal anything, that land was part of Russia and when Soviet Union broke up, Hryshev (?I think don't remember) gave it to Ukraine. Last straw for Putin was, is that Crimea, every inch of it's soil covered with Russian/Soviet Union blood from the WW2, and Ukraine's n@zzls ruling the country would not go down well. yes it's good for Russia, why?
1. Russian fleet would of probably be kicked out from there once EU integration bullshit would go down, not anymore
2. 90% of people in Crimea do not feel Ukrainian, they are Russian, no matter what west tells you... you are not from there, I got many relatives and friends of relatives still partying there from the joy while usa tv says how they were forced to vote with a gun lol
3. Putin is not a dictator, he just looks after Russian interests and the west doesn't like that... i'm sure you and the west would love for Ukraine president get killed, those n@zzls gangsters took over government, Russian language right away not allowed, IMF with huge loans to suck Ukraine's resources dry, put American bases there, kick out Russian fleet, install bunch of rockets close to the border while Putin NOT SAY A WORD? you out of your mind